Drummer Cafe Community Forum

1) Don't think you need to play thru every bar of every song. Some pop songs only require tambourine or shaker in the choruses. Play nothing in the intro, verse and bridge parts of such songs.
2) Only play a part that adds to the groove or introduces a nice colour. If the part you have chosen doesn't work, don't plough on hoping no one will notice. Think of something else to play, or stop playing completely.
2b) Once you have found parts that work, stick with them no matter what. Don't play three bars of shaker then switch to congas for the next five bars just because you are bored with the shaker part you cemented at rehearsals.
3) Latin a) grooves, b) sensibilities and c) sounds wont neccessarily work in pop. 16's on shaker and tambourine work on nearly everything. Don't expect to play congas on songs with pumping, distorted guitars.
4) Be able to read music, and/or make copious notes at rehearsals. Don't start the verse shaker part on bar two of the verse because you didn't know the first verse came after an 8 bar intro. Don't play one too many bars, shakin' your shaker, when everyone else has stopped for the solo piano section. Don't expect the drummer to cue you thru every verse, chorus, outro of every song. LEARN TO READ or get yourself a photographic memory.
5) Carry enough sound making devices to cover frequently used tones in contemporary pop. Contemporary pop often features shakers, tambourines and a variety of electronic percussion and filtered loops. Playing congas, or melodic cowbells and temple blocks wont cut it when the album version of the song you are playing features a 'funky drummer' type loop as well as real drums. Bring an e-pad and a small sampler, or carry a small snare drum and mini-hats..... or something, JUST NOT another latin conga groove or rinky tinky cowbells.
6) If the drummer is implying a shuffle groove, don't join in with a straight 16's shaker pattern. Take particular note if the drummer starts to heavily and unmusically emphasise a shuffle feel with his hi-hat.   >:(
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Recent bad experience?

I can't say I've had a bad experience with a percussionist imposing Latin styles over pop, but I've only had the experience a handful of times. I dream of being in a band with a full-time percussionist! I once had an issue with a percussionist who fancied himself as a timbalero, and showed off his skills on every song (it seemed). But that was one easily forgettable night.

I'm soaking your post in because I've broken all these rules myself as an amateur percussionist who was recently employed for a folk coffee house gig. I'm also frustrated I never seem to have enough toys, although I'm finding some fun applications for the triangle. The tambourine has always frightened me because I'm just not very consistent with it ... it's a very difficult percussion instrument! It's akin to sleigh bells, which took me a good month of practice to get the feel. But I agree it's an essential instrument to pop music, and so is the shaker. My problem is I have a hard time getting away from the shaker. It's always my fall back position. I have five different size shakers! I'm pretty good with them, though. Sometimes I get a medium sized shaker going in the right while doing slushier stuff with the big one on the left. It sounds good to me. ;)

I think a lot of drummers such as myself go into percussion think it's going to be easy. Hey, you don't need four-limb independence, right? Then you pick up a heavy metal shaker and try playing 16th notes with it in your right hand while playing congas or bongos or timbales or a cowbell or woodblock with your left and ... well, it's every bit as complicated as drum set. Also, there are so many percussion instruments, like a gourd, that unless you grow up with them are very difficult to get good sound and make plausible rhythm with them.

I try really hard to learn percussion and treat each instrument with respect. For example, I no longer look at the triangle and think of the "Twinkle, Twinkle Little Star" in 6th grade orchestra. I see it like I see a hi-hat or cymbal. I no longer look at the congas as an extension of the toms toms, rather, a group of batterie voices that need to make sense on their own as much as they need to fit with what the drummer's doing.

I still have a hard time finding where percussion fits well in the pop genre. I'm constantly dazzled by those who do it well, like Ray Cooper.

I had a bad day at the office.
But felt much better after posting this.  ;D

My absolute golden rule is number 1.
Seems like virtually every percussionist I've ever worked with has played from the first bar to the last bar of every song, even when it was patently obvious percussion wasn't needed.
I love the sound of percussion and there is nothing more powerful than a great percussionist coming in on the chorus of a song. The Chorus!!!!
Anyway, my rules apply mostly to the live scene. In the studio you can tell them what to do, or wipe the bits you don't want after they are gone.
I must admit, Danny Cummings (Dire Straits) was awesome.
Nine out of ten percussionists I've gigged with have broken almost all of my golden rules however.
My pet peeve is percussionists with crash cymbals. At best they double every crash you make, at worst they throw in crashes you (the drummer) tastefully left out.  >:(

Can we go the reverse now? Drummers need to learn how to work with percussionists too. My pet peeves in my limited experience:

- Drummers who fill all the space with toms, or play excessive tom-based grooves

- Drummers who fiddle with their cymbals all the time. Just lay it down, right? You've got a percussionist to create ambient noises.

- Drummers who try and match what you're doing, or play to a style they think they're hearing from the percussion.

I'm game.

I agree, although for his feature percussion solo on the Dire Straits song 'Calling Elvis', Danny Cummings asked me to play toms only. His theory was my preferred hi-hat groove was getting into the sonic territory of his timbales and cymbals and a low tom groove would better anchor the solo for him.
Yep. Not guilty yer honour. I'm eager for any percussionist to take the load off my shoulders. I'm ready for a towel down and a sip of beer anyway.
By the way, every song that starts with solo keyboards doesn't need the percussionist to create ambient noise. How many times a night can you stomach hearing that rainstick being tipped, while the hand not in use is gently making it's way down the mark tree? Give me a flippin' break!
Err.....where's the door?  :-X

Back to percussionists then perhaps.  ???

Might I remind anyone reading, I'm suggesting rules strictly for pop percussion. Chart album type stuff.
I realise once you get into funk, fusion, RnB, etc... the gloves are off.  ;D

Yeah, let me explain better. A song starts out with just percussion, say a simple conga groove. It drives me crazy when the drummer comes in mimicking the exact same rhythm. Unless it's explicit, like say an Afro-Pop song where the percussion lines are fairly static, the drummer needs to do something more complimentary. I guess I feel like my toes are being stepped on, and it doesn't do much for me when I hear it as just a listener.

One of my favorite stories along this line, showing the other side of the proverbial coin:  Ralph MacDonald was interviewed in Modern Percussionist magazine about twenty years ago (a short-lived offshoot of Modern Drummer, but really good for what it was - but that's another topic for another time).  He related a story of being called into a session, and having the producers say, "We've got a song we'd like to run past you."  After listening to the existing tracks, Ralph said, "I don't think that song needs any percussion."

The producers replied, "We didn't think so, either.  We just wanted to hear you say that."  And with that, they paid him for his time and sent him home.  :)

I have several of those kinds of sessions each year.

The moral of the story ... play for the music. Your a musician who happens to play ______ . If you think like a drummer OR a percussionist, you run the risk of over playing the tune. Play for the song; make music.

I can't tell you how many times I've hauled in half-dozen roadcases full of percussion gear, only to play a Shaker and Tambourine. The good news is that I have a lot of Shakers and Tambourines to choose from, but what about all that other gear I brought. A seasoned player does what is needed for the music; nothing more, nothing less. Just because you have an enormous set-up doesn't mean you have to play or hit everything at least once on the session or live gig.

I used to have a nice little article called "The Role of a Percussionist" here at the Drummer Cafe, but I can't seem to find it. Oh well.  :-\

One more. If you can't get behind rule 1-6 then try to get a sound or use a technique that no one has ever used before. The other night I was just visiting a recording session of a friend's band. I started messing around with a vibraslap, yes a vibraslap. Before long I had a pretty cool march-y type rhythm going, sort of a tap/choke kind of thing, trying to control the length of the rattle, it actually sort of sound like a castanet thing. They liked it so much they tracked it. But, boy was it tough to play it correctly consistantly. The cool thing was, it had nothing at all to do with the existing drumset part. And I'm not even a percussionist (obviously).

Don't forget hand claps. In pop music, hand claps often really make a chorus.

Chris, do these charts really have much percussion spelled out on them?
If they don't, maybe they should be more specific.

I haven't done a lot of recording, but when I'm playing percussion I do lay out a lot. I personally don't care for conga messing up my blues or rock, but conga fits good in R&B and funk.

By the way, I don't use cymbals in my percussion setup, the only metal is a string of sleigh bells and cowbell. For accents I like goat hoofs, seed pods, and nut shells shakers.

A good use of cymbals by a percussionist though was Santana's Chepito Areas in the song Jingo. He got on a floor tom pulse and drove it with crash cymbal work that made Mike Shrieve's and Michael Carabello's parts shine.

intriguing posts all. i usually play percussion with singer/guitarists who play a lot of rock and pop. no latin and very little jazz or funk........ despite being around miami.

 anyway, i often find myself struggling to find something to play behind a, say, pearl jam tune which originally featured a bunch of heavy drums. there i am with my congas looking for a beat that makes sense.

 i find it hard not to sound a little latin-y on a lot of these covers, even though i know thats not really the sound to go for.


 i use a foot pedal with a block which helps with the 4/4 on a lot of these intrinsically very simple little rock tunes. and i have added a hihat that also fills out the sound. and  yes, i, play a sabian hand splash cymbal because its usually just me. and i need it.

 and although i have some hand perc like maracas and cowbell and clave sticks, i very rarely use them because it seems like the beat is needed on congas first before i can get into the shakers and i unfortunately only have two hands and two feet.

 sometimes, i play the congas and hihat like a snare/hithat combo, using rutes which helps on rock covers that essentially derive from regular drumsets.

but i guess im always wondering what i can do on the congas alone when the solo lead guy launches into, oh, a who tune like one did the other night, which is about as anti-percussion sounding white music as you can get.

 i found a nice groove on a killers song, though, but i flailed a bit behind some of the basic rock stuff. any ideas? 8)

Rats! I'd like to read that...

Sorry man, your text was a bit too dense.....no caps, no paragraphs. Help an old guy out, please.  :-\ :-[

Absolutely no real percussion on the record we were attempting to recreate.
A few songs had programmed parts (a mixture of loops and electronic sounds which couldn't be easily replicated by acoustic percussion).
The sound of the band was basically too empty and an additional was suggested. I singularly voted for a second guitarist, as there are multiple guitar overdubs on every song. Everyone else voted for percussion, with as I said no percussion on the album.  ???
But anyway, this project aside, 99.9% of percussionists I've worked with have broken rule number 1. Namely, they've played wall to wall percussion from minute one of the gig, to the final note of the encores.
Which prompts me to restate the worn out cliche, less is more!

I immediately thought a of a heavy metal samba........... ala Bonham "Fool in the Rain"  Chris, I hope you see the joke and tomorrow is better!!!!

Yeah.  ;D

I could see it working if it is by design.
The Tubes hired Mingo Lewis who then forged an interesting partnership with drummer Prairie Prince.

your text was a bit too dense......

how's zat? ;)

If that is not a lesson in using good judgement, I don't know what is....

nice one chris. i've only ever worked with percussionists at church. mutual respect and leaving space was key to the whole drum thing fitting together neatly and interestingly.

who was the percussionist you worked with in the live dire straits shows? you and he did a ripping duet on the 'calling elvis' song (the live cd version). how much of that was planned and how much of it was free jamming?

j

Yeah Jason.
After a few bad experiences over the years I guess I'm not quite as mutually respecting as I could be.  :-\


I mentioned it earlier......Danny Cummings. A great player.
Mark Knopfler suggested he take on an extended percussion solo towards the end of 'Calling Elvis'. My instinct was to keep simple time between hi-hat and bass drum, but Danny wasn't comfortable with that. He wanted a tom groove. I'm no Manu Katche, so I asked Danny for help me create a tom pattern he would like to solo over.
Between us we came up with the basic pattern.
When we played the song live I kept to the basic pattern for most of Danny's solo, filling it out and building up the intensity towards the end. Danny's solo was completely open. He could go anywhere and go for as long as he wanted.
He had a set figure between timbales and crash cymbals to signal he was ending. When I heard that figure we counted a couple of bars, then went into another set figure between my toms and Danny timbales which cued the rest of the band in.
Therefore, if any of the dozy band musicians had nodded off, they had a big percussion cue, followed by a big drums and percussion cue to signal the end of Danny's segment.

i love hearing stuff like that. what a great experience. i do a dum duet at nearly every gig with my lead singer. he grabs some sticks and plays an african hand to hand rhythm on my floortom while i go latin over it on the high toms and keep steady pulse beneath it on the feet. from there it can go anywhere (and not always somewhere good either... about 90 % of the time its wonderful tho and when we do stuff up we make a joke of it ... he will start playing on my skull with the sticks [ouch] or we just start laughing) ... whatever the case, by the time we are done the audience is crowding the stage and roaring with approval. we used to always do the duet at the end of the gig until we figured that no matter how bad the evening was (in terms of audience response and participation) it was always 'cured' by five minutes of frenzied danceable drumming. so we now put it in the middle of the seconds set. this drum duet would not stand up well in the view of other drummers (most of the time i'm only playing accented 16ths in and around the chaos of my lead singer) but as a showmanship piece it is superb. i think the audience understands the risks we are taking and love us for doing a fair to great job (depending). having typed all of this i'm now really looking forward to tonight.

sorry to go off topic.

j

ps for those of you who haven't seen it here's the live calling elvis video i was talking about with chris commanding the tubs:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wg0kP4Jq0ME (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wg0kP4Jq0ME)

Chris- thanks for the post.
I've never really evaluated myself from a percussionists perspective before.  When I play at church and have a drummer to work with (w/o one then I'd be on drums) I keep certain "rules" or guidelines in mind I've gleaned along the way.  For example, if the drummer is playing a 1/16 beat on the hihats then I try say 1/8 beat on tambourine.  Basically just don't play the exact same pattern and thereby cover over what someone else is doing, etc.
I looked over your list and realized I probably could do well to heed a few of them a bit better.  Now I realize you aren't trying to tell everyone how to play BUT I have very limited experience on percussion and so decided last wed. night to be more conscious of just what I was doing AND don't play just because I'm there.  My judgment is very lacking compared to other seasoned percussionists but I'm all they got to work with.  No excuse or anything but it just really got me to thinking about what I was doing and perhaps more to the point, WHY I was doing it.  Did the part I was hearing really need to be played the entire time.  I'm a big fan of texture and therefore why not add texture to the song by NOT playing the entire time AAAANNND on that same point, why not flavor the entire experience by not playing at all on occasion.  Having percussion on EVERY song (or any of the other instruments for that matter but lets stick with percussion) keeps the experience form being as full as possible for NOT seasoning a song with percussion is still one choice on the artists pallet.
I hope the meaning I'm trying to convey comes through but its 1:42 am here and I'm tired so my apologies for that.

AND my thanks for the inspiration to try something different! :)

Chris, there is an old joke about getting a percusionist and a drummer to play with one another.......

Q: How do you get a percussionist and a drummer to play with one another??

A: Shoot one!!!

Chris, weve got a percussionist (dedicated percussionist) in town that when you talk to him sounds like hes really got his act together. Get him onstage and every #%&*#@!$!! tune becomes soul sacrifice. I swear im going to print your post and mail it to him without my name on it. It sounds like you used him on your latest recording >:(.

  ......gotta say this is the richest thread in awhile,  so much to ponder,  I think the reason "percussionists" overplay somtimes is to try to prove their value,  we are often seen (in non latin- african) music as expendable so NOT playing (and being the only one onstage not playing), reinforces this feeling......in some insecure players.            Playing with a drummer who doesn't even respect percussion is futile. The best is to play with a drummer who is a percussionist and has taken the time to learn and play in ensembel situations such as a samba group.  They tend to look at the big picture.  Last nights gig was with such a drummer(a young guy), he is hungry for knowlege and is studying tabla and other "world" styles.          Playing percussion well is such hard work because you need to get and stay proficient on so many instraments,    hands, sticks, shakers, shakeree , guiros,  and your timing has to be the best in the band, I love it.

That could very well be the case.


In pop music I stick with the parts and mood that are dictated by the recording.
I find many percussionists want to change the mood to suit their own needs.
So in effect I don't play sympathetically to percussionists in these situations. However, I'm perfectly willing to let percussionists have their moment(s) in the spotlight.

Once I recorded a drum track for a friend of mine, a kind of "In the stone"/Freddie White-type of groove, and we ended up with a quite good-feeling basic track with drums/bass/guitars.

Later when I heard the final mix, the 16th note hihat part had been doubled with a tambourine part, in other words identical continous 16th notes through all choruses. Pretty decent timing, but still.....I felt that the feel was "blurred" by the tambourine part.

What are your opinions on this? Can you make identical hihat/tambourine parts work together? My thoughts: we would have been better off by laying down an 8th-note hihat originally, and let the tambourine alone represent the 16th-note feel. Or simply omit the tambourine.

Yes! I have a problem with that, too. Too much static rhythm. That was likely a producer add, though, right? Producers aren't always the best ears for adding stuff. Too often they treat percussion like their own crayon box and color in the lines where white space was a better fit.

I've yet to meet a producer that wants to take something out of the mix. They'll replace bad playing, but they don't usually go into post-production looking to create space in the music. They're always asking what they can add to make it better.

Weird.
This is a recurring theme in the percussion forum.
First, an orchestral conductor who doesn't understand percussion. Now, a record producer who doesn't know how to mix properly.  :o
Most of the ones I've worked with are pretty good at editing out.

If I was the drummer I might assume the producer felt the chorus wasn't lifted enough with the same hi-hat as the verse. I agree with Peppe, an 8's feel on hi-hats might have complimented the tambourine part better, but at the end of the day I have no problem with hi-hat and tambourine playing the same pattern, especially as it was just for the chorus.
While we're on the Fred White tangent.....a good deal of the E,W&F songs featured clave playing exactly the same part as the snare, 'smearing' the backbeat. I thought it sounded GREAT.

Yes, it was my friend producing his own record, so it was his decision. I agree, sometimes producers want to "spice things up" a little too much, and this goes for overdubs in general, I think ;)

Regarding dubbed clave on the backbeat, yes I think it really sounds great too, and also dubbing the backbeat with things like tambourine and cowbell.

I guess it has a lot to do with the specific feel of the song, whether it works or not. An example: "Green earrings" by Steely Dan with Purdie on drums, where the tambourine basically supplies the 16th feel through the whole song. Purdie plays a steady 8th note pattern on the hihat, and filling in ghosted 16th on the snare, but not continiously. Try to imagine that song being played with hihat/tambourine playing 16th in unison. I think it would sound weird :-\

On the Buddy Rich album "The New One", there's a song called "The rotten kid" where a shaker plays dubbed shuffle-8ths along with the jazz-shuffle cymbal beat. To me, the shaker does no good to the feel of the song. (Other than that, it's one of Buddy's best albums IMO).

Of course, the balance (level) of percussion tracks plays an important role: there's a fine line between tasty and irritating ;)

I agree.
By and large it's great if perc and drums can find complimentary parts rather than doubling up.

Hi Chris,

I was in LA this weekend and ran into a guy who started telling me (with no promting from me except he'd just watched me play a set) about a fantastic percussionist he had seen back in the 80's with Edie Brickell & the New Bohemians. He said the dude took a long hot solo and really impressed with his style, said the guy had percussion instruments all around him and moved from one thing to the next, full of spark and fire.

I asked if Edie had a regular drummer, and the fellow said, " Ahh, yeah, I guess." The fellow didn't remember much about the drummer.

Would it be that was you???? Was the percussionist John Bush?
Did you get to take a solo too? Could this have been the beginings of a love/hate relaionship with percussionists?

For the record, I bought 'shooting rubberbands at the stars' shortly after it came out in '88, and absolutely loved your drum work on it. It is a fantastic album and I still enjoy listening to it.

No, I only played with the band for about five days in the studio. Just for the recording of the 'Rubberbands' album.

It sounds like the percussionist John Bush.
They were a great band and had worked up some unique grooves based around Bush, the guitar, the bass and original drummer Aly.
All I did was play the exact same grooves Aly had created, but in a more solid, consistent fashion.
I liked percussionist Bush, but he was taking a slight backseat while we were tracking drums.
So, no I had no problem with him stepping on my parts.  ;)

Wasn't it just a cowbell on that song? But it was kind of a hip swinging/shuffle thing. Very hip.

Yeah, just cowbell.
On other songs I'm not sure if he even played anything while we were tracking drums.

What song are you thinking of?

Probably 'What am I'. The song got a lot of radio play, and is, as you say, a hip swinging/shuffle thing, yes.

I really like the drums on 'The Air of December', 'The Wheel', and 'Now'. It is easy to see why Chris Whitten is in demand .... and oh those Stew splashes!

The song 'Circles' moves me, it captures how I've felt at times, a petulant child .....

Thanks.  :)

I like (am proud of) 'Air Of December' too.

Which led to his strong desire to stand out in the future, leading to much fire filled displays of percussion prowress, every chance he got????

I'm a little late getting in this post but I want to agree completely with your rules Chris. I play mostly at church and stay aware of not over doing it. I will say though that some of our drummers have porblems with keeping the time steady. I will keep a shaker going through parts that I would not normally play to help keep them on track. I incorporate e-pads to play a lot of the loops that are on the original recordings.

I have seen alot of drummers try and play percussion and they play like drummers. Same groove as they would play on the kit instead of complimenting what is being played.

Also it appears to me that some percussionist that are playing live will play all the time just so they are not just standing there. BUT will be playing away from the mic's so they are not picked up. Do you find that to be true?

You know something, it seems like all the remarks about working with a percussionists sound similar to the problems encountered with any ensemble of two or more like instruments. Say like a lead guitarist and rhythm guitarist or two guitarists, both trying to play lead at the same time.

Yes, some drummers think they are natural percussionists.
I think it's a seperate and complicated art.
Sometimes I'm asked to add shakers or tambourine to a drum part I've recorded.
My arm always falls off half way through the take and I'm invariably unhappy with the results.

This is a great thread.  It's also timely for me, as I just got a call a couple of days ago to record auxiliary percussion for a contemporary country session next week.

Ok, I know this thread is about pop music, but contemporary country these days isn't too far off-----I THINK.  So that's kind of what brought me to making this post to you guys here. 

So first of all, after listening to the tunes they sent me, which were rough mixes of everything that was to be recorded except percussion, I'm not really hearing much and on some songs, I'm hearing NOTHING.  My first reaction was to show up with my instruments, and take the Ralph McDonald approach and tell the artist and producer that I just didn't hear any percussion for this stuff, and I'm sure they would be fine with that.  On the other hand, I wanted to see what you guys thought about auxiliary percussion in contemporary country music.  I mean, I could certainly fit in a conga tumbao, a shaker on choruses, and even some single tambourine hits, but I'm just not hearing this stuff or thinking it is appropriate for the style.

These songs are very typical contemporary country and follow the Nashville style for the most part.  Big Telecaster leads, pedal steel ringing out, some fiddle filling in around the vocal, etc.  The drums are straightforward and there are typical country feels such as 4/4 ballad with cross-stick on 2 and 4, straight rock grooves, shuffles and a couple of train beats with brushes.  The drummer did a good job, too. 

Now, a couple of the songs are more folkish, so on those songs, I actually DO hear a kind of Simon and Garfunkel with Ralph McDonald on percussion type of approach, but for the country stuff, I'm just not hearing it.  They even said they wanted steel drum on a couple of tunes for a Jimmy Buffett thing, but there is so much lead guitar, pedal steel and strings already happening.  I will probably try a conga groove on those tunes as well, to follow that Buffett style.

But, do any of you guys play or have played contemporary country drums?  Have you worked with a percussionist before in this style?  What are some perc instruments/things that you have heard that worked well, or might work well?  I just don't hear a lot of auxiliary percussion in country music these days.  ??

I'm reminded of something Alex Acuña said in a Modern Drummer interview many years ago.  The interviewer asked, "What's the difference between a 'drummer' and a 'percussionist?'" 

Alex answered, good-naturedly, "If you give an ash tray to a percussionist, he'll try and get a sound out of it.  If you give an ash tray to a drummer, he'll light up a cigarette."  ;)

It is definitely a different discipline, being a percussionist instead of a drummer - with different techniques, different instruments, a different vocabulary, etc.  I think that's one reason why I love to listen to drummers who are also accomplished "percussionists" - Airto, Don Alias, Trilok Gurtu, Alex Acuña, et al.  There's often a different dimension in their playing, versus someone whose sole instrument is the drum set.  (Please note:  that's "different" - not "better" or "worse.")

For the drummers here who want to learn how to play well with percussionists, take up some of the percussion instruments, and play with a drummer.  It works the other way as well - a percussionist would do well to play some drum set with another percussionist.  Get a sense of what the other player is dealing with.  If you know what it feels like to set up a nice conga groove, only to have the drummer play a linear groove all over the toms, or what it feels like (as a drummer) to have the groove screwed up by an overzealous percussionist who grabs a new instrument every three-and-a-half bars, you'll be less likely to commit that same infraction when you're back on your native instrument.

All I know is, I became a much more sensitive and responsible accompanist on drum set after I switched to jazz vibes and had a few drummers step all over my solos.  You learn very quickly what it is that you do - and don't - like to hear, and that can't help but inform your own playing.

(As always, YMMV.)

The mix you have may have been recorded before the steel drum decision.  Surely the guitar and pedal steel will leave you some room at the session.

That can cause problems in other parts of your life......... ::)

James-
Well put!!