vexen
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« on: June 24, 2005, 12:55 AM » |
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Couldn't find any previous posts on the subject, but if there are, just lead me in the right direction.
I was just wondering, has anyone ever taken a really bad cymbal, and cut it in any way, adding holes like the ozone cymbals, or just cutting the edges. Just wondering if any experience has been had. I have a pair of horrible hi-hats and a crash taht i got for 20 bucks at Guitar Center, and since i no longer need them (yes, i was that desperate for a substitute) i was wondering what i could do to them for some intersting fun and sound.
Any feedback would be nice.
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Out of the place of flowers I come, Priest of the Sunset, Lord of the Twilight.
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Pirate Pig
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give the drummer some!
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« Reply #1 on: June 24, 2005, 01:17 AM » |
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Yes I just did a cymbal. I turned a wuhan 12" cheapo china cymbal I got for about 12 bucks haha. I first sanded it down super thin to make it have more sustain which worked. I then decided to try and hammer some heavy dents into the cymbal. This shortened the sustain very seriously I wouldn't reconmend it unless u want short short sustain. Now interestingly I thought I was done and started to play it. Then it cracked, back to the drawing boards I went haha. Next i drilled the cracks on the edges and from the dents. Suddenly I got a great idea. I wanted a white noise type of cymbal and I noticed the cracks were giving a very cool scratchy white noise type of sound. So I MADE cracks on the edges of the cymbal and sanded them down so they were rounded and smoother and so they wouldn't spread any farther (i used a dremal). Then any parts that I thought would spread more I drilled. I then gave it a light sanding to give it a nice look. I did a different finish on the outter rim of the china and a smooth finish on the inside with a ring of rough kinda like the bosphorus sultain cymbals. I played it and it has this weird white noise it sounds like a muted whina mixed with a tamborine! I like it, it defaintly works when im playing lightly but it would be need to be mic'd to be up to the level of normal cymbals. I'm very glad I took the time and risk to mess with it, it was totally an enjoyable experience, even if i had ruined it and hated it I still had loads of fun that was worth far more than 12 bucks! I totally have intergrated it into the set. My only problem with this is im very sure its lifespand will be short and its sound will change with playing because of how fragile a cracked cymbal tends to be. I'd say if you spent 20 bucks on these cymbals then totally go forward and get a dremal (for sure) an electric sander some sort of vice some hammers and chissels and other tools maybe a torch and just go crazy. But most importantly sit down first and think about the sound you want to get and the sound you think is possible to get from it. Then think about the ways to get that sound. Remember if you dent it or drill it heavily its going to cut sustain (as far as i know) if you thin it out with torches and sanding its going to create more sustain but make a trashier sound (as far as i know). Now if anyone thinks im wrong please tell me because I almsot want to go out and buy cheap cymbals at pawn shops just to manipulate them so please lets get all our knowledge together on this.
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Pirate Pig
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give the drummer some!
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« Reply #2 on: June 24, 2005, 01:25 AM » |
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Also I have a 14" B8 crash i bought for a jam session that I don't really use anymore because i have my 20" ZIldjian Oriental Crash of Doom that I got used at a pawn shop! Plus I'm getting another 18" crash used on the 11th so when i get that cymbal I'm going to just torch the @$%# out of the B8 so I can warp it heavily kinda like a zildjian trasformer. Then Im going to drill it and buy some rivets off ebay and put them in it! I think the torch I have will be too hot for cymbals, I noticed on the wuhan china the dremal got it hot enough to buble the metal!
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attempting to be the meat and potatoes not the icing
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vexen
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« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2005, 09:34 AM » |
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haha sounds like some fun with the wuhan china, i have one myself, got it and a boom stand for like 30 bucks, if i had another china to replace it, i'd like the white noise sound. Thanks for the advice. Anyone else's input would be nice too.
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Out of the place of flowers I come, Priest of the Sunset, Lord of the Twilight.
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563
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« Reply #4 on: June 24, 2005, 01:11 PM » |
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As we like to say in the graphics world, you can't polish a turd. If its junk to begin with, you'll likely end up with a different sounding piece of junk. If you're down with that, then it doesn't really matter what you do.
Generally speaking if you decrease the diameter of a cymbal it'll get clangier. Taking a 16" crash down to 12" wont make a splash. It'll make more of a bell. Because the thickness at the edge of the cymbal (and relatively speaking the rest of the shoulder as well) is thicker than would ever be used on a crash/splash of that size.
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Making bad art. Saying stupid things. Implimenting my master plan to be forgotten when I'm gone and forgettable while I'm here. The Luna MothmeTableland
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vexen
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« Reply #5 on: June 24, 2005, 01:44 PM » |
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I'm not expecting it to turn into a 150 dollar cymbal, i'm just thinking about maybe creating a unique sound that i personally like, i'm a fan of the trashy china sound, so these things are absolutely horrible, its just i figure, why have something thati know i would never actually incorporate into a song cuz its not quite what i want. instead i'd rather test it to see if i can come up with something i possibly would incorporate. they do sound sort of like... tiny gongs... so i'm keeping 1 of them as a cheap gong ;p
like i mentioned earlier, the ozone cymbals are cool sounding things, and i doubt anyone really thought it would sound cool until it was tested... its a unique sound.... only 1 way to find out right?
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Out of the place of flowers I come, Priest of the Sunset, Lord of the Twilight.
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563
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« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2005, 02:47 PM » |
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i'm just thinking about maybe creating a unique sound that i personally like ... only 1 way to find out right?
Precisely why I said : If you're down with that, then it doesn't really matter what you do.  Go for it, cut away.
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Making bad art. Saying stupid things. Implimenting my master plan to be forgotten when I'm gone and forgettable while I'm here. The Luna MothmeTableland
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Joe
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« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2005, 03:01 PM » |
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As we like to say in the graphics world, you can't polish a turd.
Obviously you, sir, have never tried! What?
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I'm not a particularly slow player, yet I don't play fast. I play half-fast.
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Drumodad
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Loose Grips to Ya!
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« Reply #8 on: June 25, 2005, 10:36 PM » |
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I took a severly broken 22"A Zildjian ride to my friends body shop,cut it down,polished the edge. Now I have a great sounding 8" splash. This cymbal can be heard at the 12 second mark on my part in the community solo,and also used as a ride starting at the 54 second mark to 101 seconds.
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that1drummer
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« Reply #9 on: June 27, 2005, 08:16 AM » |
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i cut a 18" Zildjian crash into a star and it sounded really ... ummm... unique. The sound is not very pleasent but can be used for a few things.
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DrumerFromSysinoid
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« Reply #10 on: June 27, 2005, 09:29 PM » |
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Me and my mates at a jam got bored once, so we grabbed my cheap $40 ride and started hammering it, didn't turn out too great, we inverted it tho, that was interesting... THen later we got a 2nd one i'd bought and just inverted it without hammering it up, it sounded like i was riding a big chunk of steal in a factory! it was great! BUT ITS MY IDEA, MINE FIRST!!! anyway, a few months later we dug out the first one and had a go at it with a sledge hammer until it broke open, then at my bands last jam before we broke up, we completely destroyed it until it was like, shards.... hehe 
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563
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« Reply #11 on: June 28, 2005, 10:56 AM » |
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BUT ITS MY IDEA, MINE FIRST!!! Well, not really, no.
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Making bad art. Saying stupid things. Implimenting my master plan to be forgotten when I'm gone and forgettable while I'm here. The Luna MothmeTableland
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cragar
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« Reply #12 on: June 28, 2005, 01:15 PM » |
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I posted this before...if you want a clean job, take the cymbal to a machine shop that has a "plasma" cutter. It's like a laser and the edges come out perfect. My cracked 16" paper thin Zildjian is now a very unique 10" splash. Cost $4.50 and it took the guy maybe 4 minutes. (Most modern machine shops have plasma cutters...call around)
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Pirate Pig
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give the drummer some!
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« Reply #13 on: June 28, 2005, 08:04 PM » |
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Giggidy giggidy giggidy... I just took my 14" sabian b8 crash (30 bucks or so) bought it to tide me over till i got my real crash (20" zildjian oriental crash of doom) Anyway I took it and... *sanded it down till it was super paper thin on the edges but too thin *torched it untill it was soft I then very slowly over three torching sessions warped it till it drooped down on both sides.
This produce a almost china sound, decay was very extreme and when the initial sound of the crash had died it had this very high pitched washy overtone very sci fi sounding. The warping made the trashyness very extreme (what i was looking for) I wasn't expecting the extremely long decay though. I found the sides that I had pulled down were lower in tone while the sides that were higher were higher in tone. I went back to the work bench.
I drilled 5/8" holes, one on each side in the middle of the shoulder. Let it cool down warped it slightly more.
After this was done I got more control on the decay, it shortened but kept that great overtone I liked. Then I went overboard. Uptill then I had had a plan on what I was doing and had a pretty good idea what sound i was going to get. Then I figured hmm what the heck would happen if i heated and hammered the bell. So I started to do that not having a clue what was going to happen, I then proceeded to flatten the bell a little bit till it was dented small and large and the top was flat. Let it cool and....
I got a very high pitched cymbal with almost a china sound with the spread of a gong. It radiates with a strong cutting trashy crash then leaves you with vibrating overtones that are somewhat nasal so to spead and could be described as white noise. The holes and the hammered down bell help slow the decay and control the initial crash as so their isn't to much wash. If I could go back I think I would of not hammered the bell so much but I love this cymbal, it looks like a cross between a Zildjian Transformer and a Zildjian earth ride very dirty looking i had to sand it and clean it with groove juice then some light torching just for asthetic peroposes. I'm possibly thinking about adding 3 rivets to it when i get them in the mail but I'm not sure. I plan on hunting pawn shops for dirt cheap cymbal to totally work into weird noises. Totally positive experience guys. All I used was *dremal *sandpaper *electric sander *propane torch *drill bits+drill *chisel *mallet *heavy duty vice
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