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Author Topic: Has this NIGHTMARE happened to you?  (Read 1678 times)
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Bart Elliott
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« Reply #20 on: July 09, 2003, 06:55 AM »

I think 563's experience is unique ... but the end result only proves my point ... "It takes a life time to build a good reputation, and only one moment in time to ruin it."  Although Mark (aka 563) had good reasons for not making the gig, it still affected his reputation. He made the choice that was right for him (and is probably what most of use would have done) ... but wrong or right, our decisions and the way we conduct ourselves does fall into a "cause & effect" scenario. Some people will understand your actions, others will not. Each of us have to weigh what is important or worth fighting for ... knowing that it may tarnish our reputations with some individuals.
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« Reply #21 on: July 09, 2003, 08:12 AM »

Each of us have to weigh what is important or worth fighting for ... knowing that it may tarnish our reputations with some individuals.

Thats pretty much how I looked at it.  Weighed the situation, made my choice.   I was curious as to how you guys wouldve reacted and Im glad to hear 'em all, including Pauls.  I certainly wouldnt expect everyone to agree with my decision  Smiley   Id just never been "the irresponsible one" before so I had a hard time coming to grips with my drummers attitude.  Two bridges were burned over that.  He wont play with me again, and I wont play with him.  

And I think thats the key thing.  To simply be aware that your actions effect those around you.  Period.  

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« Reply #22 on: July 09, 2003, 08:55 AM »

So heres my question.  Was I unprofessional?  Was I that guy? Or would you say that circumstances were a little out of the ordinary and forgivable.  

The great college basketball coach, John Wooden once said, "Worry more about your character than your reputation. Character is what you are, reputation is merely what others think you are."

Some people spend their lives worrying about how others perceive them. It's really a losing game. You did what you thought was right at the time. That's all anyone can do.

I think you made the right choice considering the circumstances. And we all learned something from your ordeal.

Don't go anywhere near the airport on the day of a gig.  Grin
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« Reply #23 on: July 09, 2003, 12:36 PM »

(oh no,  here we go again  Grin)



But yes dump his disrespectful a$$.

I have a short fuse for idiots, especially when they make ME look bad.

looser Tongue
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« Reply #24 on: July 09, 2003, 12:58 PM »

looser Tongue
WHAM,WHAM,WHAM...I don't care if the horse is dead >:(WHAM,WHAM,WHAM.....LOL
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« Reply #25 on: July 09, 2003, 01:46 PM »

I've never had a band mate be too drunk to play before the show started, but I have had my guitar player get too drunk to finish playing the last set and just quit in the middle of a song! On a New Years Eve gig no doubt! Ok so that wouldn't have been too bad except for the fact we're a 3 piece band!  Angry It was NOT pretty! It also wasn't the first time he'd gotten totally fried at a show. Since we've had a heart to heart (all 3 of us) about how that really ticks me off, he's much more attentive of how much he drinks. I have no problem with someone "knocking the edge off" at a show. But this is a job! We get paid for this. It doesnt matter how much money. Thats not the point. We agree to play and entertain for a price. If you cant do the job, get the hell out of MY way! Thats my two cents! Yeah I'd say your bass player needs a wake up call Big Skittle. Not sure if I'd fire him or not. That's up to you. But he'd be on notice for sure!  
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« Reply #26 on: July 09, 2003, 08:03 PM »

I think 563's experience is unique ... but the end result only proves my point ... "It takes a life time to build a good reputation, and only one moment in time to ruin it."  Although Mark (aka 563) had good reasons for not making the gig, it still affected his reputation. He made the choice that was right for him (and is probably what most of use would have done) ... but wrong or right, our decisions and the way we conduct ourselves does fall into a "cause & effect" scenario. Some people will understand your actions, others will not. Each of us have to weigh what is important or worth fighting for ... knowing that it may tarnish our reputations with some individuals.

I agree with you, Bart, and these are the types of choices people in any profession make. Ethical choices tend to cost us something. If he was a young lawyer skipping out on a court date, it wouldn't be any less costly to his career. Did he make the right decision? Of course. Having strong character tends to cost something in the real world.
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« Reply #27 on: July 11, 2003, 06:04 AM »

Part of the problem might be that musicians have heard so many excuses from so many other musicians that when you have a legitimate reason, they're inclined to disbelieve it.  Especially if it happens before you've had a chance to establish yourself as a reliable player.
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« Reply #28 on: July 11, 2003, 05:00 PM »

There is one magic word that keeps me from being a flake....

NEXT!!!
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« Reply #29 on: July 16, 2003, 06:11 AM »

You guys have all heard of Leo Kottke, right?
(one of the best guitarists ever!)
A friend of mine was the guy who had to go pick him up at the airport and show him to the venue that night. So Leo gets off the plane completely loaded and stumbling. The first thing he asks my friend is, "Hey, where's a fella go for a good drink in this town?"
So, they go and he gets more loaded.
My friend is really worried that this character can play at all.

That night he played alone with a 12 string acoustic guitar to a packed house and brought it down like a champ! It was probably the most amazing single guitar act I've ever seen to this day!

Anyway, the point is that it's not the alcohol - it's the man..
I think that was something Bart was alluding to when he looks into a man's soul..

If you're around people a lot you're going to effect each other quite bit. You have the power to sometimes be a positive force in a guy's life, and maybe even vear them away from disaster or suffering.
And vice-versa.
Be compassionate. And don't mistake compassion for weakness - It isn't.
We all die sometime, and that makes us all even.

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« Reply #30 on: July 16, 2003, 04:51 PM »

That night he played alone with a 12 string acoustic guitar to a packed house and brought it down like a champ! It was probably the most amazing single guitar act I've ever seen to this day!

Imagine how well he could've played sober! And he would've remember the show too! I feel sorry for the guy.  Undecided
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« Reply #31 on: July 17, 2003, 12:28 PM »

Here in Branson, Missouri, everyone is a pro -  and part of being a pro means keeping your act together.  

Want to keep your gig?  Well, then be a pro - and that means staying straight, acting like an adult, and not being an idiot.

The guy in your story would never work here.  He would do that just one time, and the "grapevine" would be spreading the word out real quick about him.  

You want to have a drink, fine......AFTER the gig is over, and you're on your own time, but even then, it's not cool to be seen wasted in public, at least around these parts (and I'm sure that applies to almost anywhere, for that matter).

Me, I've got too much responsiblity on my shoulders to ever show up drunk.  And yes, I'll have a drink, but it's always when I get home - AND, it's only one or two drinks, no more that that, I like to wake up the next morning feeling like a human being.

To paraphrase Bartman's saying - you never get a SECOND chance to make a good FIRST impression.

Learn from the experience.  Next time you hire a player, make sure his attitude is that of a professional, and you'll be 'way ahead in the game.

Regards,
drumz1
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« Reply #32 on: July 17, 2003, 01:29 PM »

My friend opened up for B.B. King one time.  He said his band was just about to go out on stage when he saw the drummer at the bar with a double shot in each hand.  My friend, who is normally really laid back and wouldn't normally make a blatant physical threat to someone, went up to the drummer and said, "3 words for you.  If you screw this up for me I'm going to KICK -- YOUR -- A*S."
He said the drummer left his shots on the bar....


My friend just told me this story...
This past weekend a certain famous metal drummer came into Houston to play a show with my friend's band.  My friend (guitarist) basically worships this guy, as his band's music majorly influenced him over the years.
Well, anyway, to make a long story short, when my friend picked him up at the airport on 9am Friday, the drummer was already hammered.  When he got in the car, he downed 3 hot beers that had been in my friend's trunk for ages and my friend said he told him, "Hey man, hold on, we'll get you a cold one but he downed those AND wanted to stop at the store.  Anyway, my friend said this guy stayed absolutely snotsligging drunk from morning til night for 3 days and didn't even take a shower once, smelling up my friend's entire house.  The poor guy has let himself go so bad that his teeth have all rotted out and he's virtually skin and bones.  The guy was totally broke and couldn't afford any food all weekend and my friends had to feed him, which was not a big deal because they were honored to buy their famous drum hero food, but still, my buddy was really crushed to see one of his mentors in such a pathetic situation and could not believe it.  He didn't understand how such a famous drummer could be so broke with all the great albums he's been on, etc.   He asked me, "What is it with these rockstars!?" I told him alcoholism/ drug addiction is a disease that affects many kinds of people, not just musicians...but, yeah...talk about an occupational hazard!!  You're in the partying environment everyday and people are always giving you free drinks and/or whatever else you want.  If I drank all the drinks people sent me in a night I'd fall off the stage.
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« Reply #33 on: July 17, 2003, 03:14 PM »

That's just plain terrible.

In my college days, there were TONS of people who would say "dude, I wanna PARTY with you!!!" With all the drugs I did, not once did I pay for them. Never paid for alcohol, either.

Now I'm in a somewhat sober band. The guitarist and I will have a beer or two after rehearsal or AFTER the show. That's as hard as it gets. Our bass player doesn't drink alcohol, caffeine, or sodas. He avoids the deli tray. He doesn't even eat chocolate. His only vice is sleeping.

Being clear-headed has great advantages.
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ritarocks
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« Reply #34 on: July 17, 2003, 07:09 PM »

One time our bassist got way hammered and screwed up the entire gig. He denied it the next day when we brought it up.  So we busted out the videotape. He was really embarrassed when he saw how badly he played and quit getting so blasted after that.
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« Reply #35 on: July 19, 2003, 12:26 AM »

Another fine example that the "tape" doesn't lie.  Grin

Tom
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« Reply #36 on: July 30, 2003, 02:12 AM »

Outside the square a bit but  there are occasions that one just can't cut it due to family, illness etc and provided the excuse is excusable, my band keeps subs up it's sleeve to fill a gap here and there. Not a common occurance but it's real handy to have someone you can rely on fill in for a night and not disrepute the band. Iv'e also done this for other bands at minutes notice, the show must go on.  Grin
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