smoggrocks
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Is there another word for synonym?
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« on: November 29, 2004, 10:28 AM » |
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i spent a large part of the holiday weekend listening to Brand X cds. this was phil collins's 'other band' before, betwixt and/or around the time period he had with genesis.
omg.
there's this one tune called 'nuclear burn' that i can't stop listening to. it's got a funk/latin/fusion thing going on, and phil is a sheer joy to listen to. does some cool syncopated snare/hi-hat 16th note stuff, and his single strokes are so crisp and articulated. what's also cool is how smooth and light he is on the bass drum. the overall effect is so composed and so cool, but always with that forward propulsion that makes you sit there listening on the edge of your seat.
i'm always blown away at how... evolved... so much older music is. i know there is plenty of great music still out there, but when you think of the earlier fusion stuff, there is a freshness, anticipation and modernity to it that i don't always find in newer music. it just seems like these guys were exposed to so much incredible music, and were anxious to weave it into their playing.
i'm going to have to follow up and see if mr. c. ever does music in this vein now. this is the kind of music i really dig and want to learn from.
killer stuff!!!
any other brand x fans out there?
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moosetication
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« Reply #1 on: November 29, 2004, 10:46 AM » |
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any other brand x fans out there? Oh yes... |
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After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music. Aldous Huxley
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paul
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« Reply #2 on: November 29, 2004, 10:48 AM » |
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Count me in for Brand X.
You might also look for a band named Gong, from the same era.
Nice stuff from both.
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The presence of those seeking the truth is infinitely preferable to the presence of those who think they've found it. - Terry Pratchett My drum page |
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Chris Whitten
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« Reply #3 on: November 29, 2004, 10:51 AM » |
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I think Brand X were formed well after Mr Collins had firmly established his reputation as a sticksmith with Genesis. In the UK scene it was actually (briefly) hip to be in a fusion band, towards the end of the 70's, into the early 80's. Remember Level 42?  Anyway, Brand X put out a few albums in that period. There were other drummers involved by the way, including Kenwood Dennard. Apart from Brand X (not my cup of tea) I think Collins is hugely underrated as a drummer. He can groove and covers quite a large collection of toms and cymbals with an effortless ease. There were comments recently that he ruined the Zep portion of Live Aid. I dunno, but every other time I've seen him play kit he's been burnin'.  |
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Christopher
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That's MR. Colaiuta to you...
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« Reply #4 on: November 29, 2004, 11:50 AM » |
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There were comments recently that he ruined the Zep portion of Live Aid. I dunno, but every other time I've seen him play kit he's been burnin'. Ruin is a little harsh of a term. I'd say he did very little to contribute. How's that? Phil is a monster though. Outside of the very impressive work that he's done with Genesis and Brand X, I'm a big fan of his playing with Plant and Clapton. Now, if we can just get him to stop singing "Brother Bear" type stuff and get back to drumming... Little known Phil Fact: A (pre-famous) Phil played on George Harrison's incredible solo album "All Things Must Pass" in 1970. |
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"What one man can do, another can do."
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Chris Whitten
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« Reply #5 on: November 29, 2004, 12:06 PM » |
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A pre famous Phil Collins appeared in films as a child actor. BTW, don't shoot the messenger re: Live Aid. Some people were quite rabidly slamming Collins on another forum, basically because Plant and Page have refused to let the Zep portion of the show go onto the DVD.  |
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moosetication
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« Reply #6 on: November 29, 2004, 01:23 PM » |
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He ... covers quite a large collection of toms and cymbals with an effortless ease... ... with incredibly short sticks. His signature model is like 14.5" long. |
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After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music. Aldous Huxley
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KevinD
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« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2004, 02:45 PM » |
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... with that forward propulsion that makes you sit there listening on the edge of your seat.
And his Tarzan stuff doesn't do the same for you??? I always thought Phil Collins was really good, I used to listen to a lot of Genesis and Brand X, (Mike Clark did some stuff with them too). I liked their compositions and the way they tied together odd time signatures and the like. He had some pretty big shoes to fill in taking over both the drum and vocals spots. The only thing was that when he was playing simple stuff like a 2 & 4 groove I always felt (maybe it was just me) that he played way on top of the beat, and everything seemed kind of tense and pushing forward. |
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irishthump
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« Reply #8 on: November 29, 2004, 02:46 PM » |
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... with incredibly short sticks. His signature model is like 14.5" long. Yeah, I know, I use them! It's nice to see Promark catering for the diminutive drummers with small hands! Anyway, Phil ROCKS!!! So underrated...... |
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"Free your mind, and your sticks will follow....."
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Chris Whitten
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« Reply #9 on: November 29, 2004, 02:52 PM » |
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I always felt (maybe it was just me) that he played way on top of the beat, and everything seemed kind of tense and pushing forward.
It could be. It also might not be a reason to criticise. I've always felt there was an on top of the beat feel to many British drummers and a more laid back snare from the Americans. I've heard American drummers playing quintessentil British music and sounding flat, British drummers playing American rock and sounding like they are rushing. In my experience there are definitely two schools. |
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irishthump
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« Reply #10 on: November 29, 2004, 02:56 PM » |
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I've heard American drummers playing quintessentil British music and sounding flat, British drummers playing American rock and sounding like they are rushing.
In my experience there are definitely two schools. This discussion is almost deserving of a new thread! I've noticed a fundemental difference in American and British (and European) drummers. I think that British drummers have a more earthy, grungy style to them in general. While the US guys have a more honed, precise sound to them. I don't put this down to a qustion of techinique though. |
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"Free your mind, and your sticks will follow....."
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KevinD
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« Reply #11 on: November 29, 2004, 03:45 PM » |
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It could be.
It also might not be a reason to criticise.
Oh I'm not criticising, that is his style, nothing wrong with that especially given the multitudes of success he has had as a player. A good example of what I'm talking about would be on "Pledge Pin" on Robert Plant's Pictures at Eleven Album. I've heard the Yank behind the beat vs. Brit on top of or ahead of the beat for years, other than a few Phil Collins examples I can't say I really noticed it all that much. |
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moosetication
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« Reply #12 on: November 29, 2004, 03:56 PM » |
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And his Tarzan stuff doesn't do the same for you? Since I have, Lo! these many moons since, ceased giving a fast, flying fez what other people think, I can say here and now that I happen to like some of the stuff on the Tarzan soundtrack. So there. |
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After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music. Aldous Huxley
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Commander
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« Reply #13 on: November 29, 2004, 05:38 PM » |
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I'm a huge Brand-X fan too! I also loved his playing on John Martyn's Grace and Danger album. Beautiful open sound to his kit.
And as for Planty's Pledge Pin - great track!
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bilkay
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Where's that @$%# drum key?
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« Reply #14 on: November 29, 2004, 06:40 PM » |
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This discussion is almost deserving of a new thread!
I've noticed a fundemental difference in American and British (and European) drummers. I think that
British drummers have a more earthy, grungy style to them in general. While the US guys have a more honed, precise sound to them. I don't put this down to a qustion of techinique though.
Phil Collins (and Bill Bruford) are nothing if not precise. Oh, Phil's work in Gabriel era Genesis (and later, Brand X) was a HUGE influence on my playing. |
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irishthump
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« Reply #15 on: November 29, 2004, 07:21 PM » |
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Phil Collins (and Bill Bruford) are nothing if not precise No, no, don't get me wrong. I'm just saying that British drummers have a somewhat "looser" feel, without losing any of the accuracy. Ringo and Bonham are two prime examples. |
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"Free your mind, and your sticks will follow....."
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bilkay
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Where's that @$%# drum key?
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« Reply #16 on: November 29, 2004, 07:33 PM » |
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Ringo and Bonham are two prime examples.
Oops! My bad!  |
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Chris Whitten
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« Reply #17 on: November 30, 2004, 02:01 AM » |
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Mitch Mitchel and Moonie are prime examples of the 'on top' feel.
Lets not overstate it however, lets not say every American drummer is laid back either. It's just a general tendency I feel.
I agree that most American drummers have a precise skill.
Most successful American drummers I've met have studied technique, perhaps been through the college system etc...
The British equivalents have often come up through playing in bands (right from school age) and are a bit more earthy IMO.
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justdave01
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Anybody got a can of groove I can borrow?
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« Reply #18 on: December 31, 2004, 06:21 PM » |
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In the Air Tonight is why I became a drummer. riding down the rode beatin the hell outa the back of my dad's seat when I was about 10 or so.
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a pata who?
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tkitna
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« Reply #19 on: December 31, 2004, 08:50 PM » |
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Little known Phil Fact: A (pre-famous) Phil played on George Harrison's incredible solo album "All Things Must Pass" in 1970.
Yes, but only the congas on the song 'The Art of Dying'. Still cool though due to the fact he was pretty much an unknown teenager at the time. A couple guest drum spots that Phil played that I loved were "Fridas" - 'Somethings Going On' (great beat) and Eric Claptons 'Bad Love' off of "Journey Man". Two good rockers. |
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"I'm not going to say anything because nobody believes me when I do."
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