DRUMMER CAFE

Well, this is going to sound a little self-serving but, if you look back a few months you'll see that I have posted this opinion before.

Obviously, you want condernser mics - not dynamics.  I think the AKG C1000S is THE mic to use for congas, djembe, bongos, percussion racks, etc.   It's also pretty great for overhead mic'ing of cymbals.

The AKG is probably the closest thing to a studio quality mic that will hold up under gigging conditions and, while they aren't cheap, they are also not so expensive that you'd be afraid to haul them into a club.   I use 2 for my live shows.  I mount them on booms so I can swing them around a bit to get them closer to whatever I'm playing on a particular song.  

2 of them do a fantastic job on my 3 congas - I keep them overhead at about 12" above my setup.    I can also play my tambourines and various shakers near them and get excellent sensitivity.  

Opinions vary, of course but, I am a firm believer that you should never put a mic right on the head of your congas because you don't get the sound of the drum - you just get the sound of your hands hitting the head.    Some people even like to put a condenser mic at the base of their shells, in addition to overhead because, the sound of the whole drum is much more than just the head.   I've got a double diaphragm condenser that I can use at the base of my triple conga stand but, to be honest, I've never done that for a live show - too complicated for most sound guys in the clubs.

Now, the self-serving part of this is that I bought a bunch of them from a guy who was selling the whole lot at one price on eBay.  I've checked them all out and they all work fine.   I'm keeping 3 of them and selling the others.  If you look in the classifieds, you'll see them.  I may go down a bit on the price if you ask.

I have a full set of congas (tumba, quinto, conga & bongos), djembe, rack with various attachments (bell tree, blocks, tamb...), 2 cymbals. Also use in hand; shakers, tamb, shekeres...
In other words a fairly large set up.

I picked up the Nady 7 drum pack mainly for the cost factor. So I put the 4 tom/snare mics on the congas and bongos. The kick mic I put on the top of the djembe (which actually works pretty good to get the lows and highs) and the 2 condensor mics, one overhead and one close to the mounted stuff.

It's not bad but the mics on the drums don't pick up the full range, you get what you pay for.

So what are the thoughts on this kind of set up with out breaking the bank but not sacrificing quality.

Sounds like a decent enough setup and its just that the mic's aren't cutting it for you.   Which would invariably cost more to fix.   The Audix Ds run about $150 each (with the clamp).   Maybe replace one at a time till you get it all up to spec?

Well I know it is not my playing, I have been playing for many years with good instruction. No offense taken.

I actually just emailed him and asked what he thinks the problem is. I do have all the drum mic's going into a small mixer then he gets the feed from that. We had board space issues before but now we have a new system and have plenty of room. SO my question to him was maybe it is an EQ or placement issue. So i might try going direct from each mic to his board so he can have full control of each drum.

I was mainly looking for other ideas so I can throw stuff at him and at least sound like I know what I'm talking about.  

Yeah, I'd be willing to bet the problem is your mixer, not your mics..
If you're on a stage that's wooden and/or you're anywhere near the kit drummer or bass, then he's going to want to use a good bit of bass roll-off depending on how far your mics are from the drum head.
Not sure if your mixer was doing any equalizing on the way to the main feed,, but if nothing else it's changing a relatively pure signal from the mic to something else by the time it gets to the main board... And your instrument is acoustic!
Mixers can really gum up the mix because they add compunding variables to an already difficult equation for the sound man..
Were you using it to reduce the number of feeds to the main?
Or were you eq-ing on the way to the main?

Good luck!
Dave

The wrong mic for the job will be the wrong mic for the job inside the drum or outside.  

While I always feel that "worse" mics aren't inherently bad, all mics have a character.   A frequency and dynamic response all their own.  And if that mic can't translate some of the stuff you want, then it won't work for you.   Not saying the mixer isn't the problem, just saying that just because its a "drum" mic, doesn't mean its the mic for you.

I have talked to the guy at Advanced in the past and he metioned micing inside congas before with good results. He is supposed to match up a mic for the drums I have. We will see and I will pass on what he comes up with. AND if I use them I will let you know what I think.

NO WAY will I drill into my drums!! If you look at the mounting system on those mics they would bolt onto the side. I would probably use the bolts they put on the drum for the stands. I would just run the cord out the bottom. That is IF I go with this system.

Thanks For All Your Inputs!!!

I know it has been awhile since any response to this post, I just remembered it and went back to read the responses. So I thought I should give an update.

Here is the final report.

On one of the replys I mentiond putting a mic's inside the congas. We tried that and it sounded awful. The sound guy couldn't even dial anything in that was close. So we nixed that idea.

I went with the Audix D2 on the congas and the D1 on the bongo. I found these mic's great for the price and they do sound better then the Nady's. A much cleaner and true sound. I like the close micing on stage so they don't pick up other instruments I am playing which gives the sound guy better control. I still need some overheads to pick up the other percussion so I am still looking for them. One thing we found with the Nadys was noise. They were noisy as in they picked up the cord hitting the side of the drum while I was playing. I could just tap the cord and hear it. I am still using the Nady overheads and the other day I went to move it a little while it was hot and there was all kinds of weird sounds coming from it, more then the usual noise while moving a mic. Anyway I'm happy with the Audix, I would recommend them.

Thanks for all the replies, it was all helpful!!!

Thanks Louis.

I don't think it was the cord as it was all the mics doing it. I'm still keeping the nady's around, there not that bad and will be a good back up.

I notice you will drum for BBQ. My wife is from KC and we have gone there to visit family. Of course we have to have BBQ when we are there. SO if you or anyone reading this ever get to KC I highly recommend "Jack Stack BBQ" . The best I have had and don't forget the beans. They do have a web site where you can mail order there food.       jackstackbbq.com
Check it out if ever in KC.

A while back I purchased a bunch of decent, reliable mics. Then I got into a discussion with my son-in-law, who is a very knowledgeable and experienced soundman. He works with schools, plus bands.....One interesting fact he pointed out was, "Chip, you've got some really decent gear. Much better than the sound equipment the bands you play with use. You can have the best mics made, but if you play them through an inferior sound system it still doesn't do your gear justice. The same goes for the guy turning the knobs. Great gear, bad mix, still equals inferior sound. It's all got to work together to be a good sound." I know I prefer to not put my mics right on top of everything. I prefer to get more of an ambient sound rather than all attack. I want to hear my gear as natural as possible. But he sure is right about bands sound systems and the sound man. There's some great answers here, but experimenting with the room and mic placement does wonders. I know if I was playing congas and side percussion the SM81's would be my choice for overheads. Good mics, but expensive. But that's me.... Nothing wrong with any of those mics mentioned. Placement and mixing gear was something I came to realize from a guy much younger, but very experienced. Experiment with what you have, you'll be surprized at the results if you take your time. And that sound changes with each room and different sound reinforcement systems used. It's all got to work together.  But it's a catch 22, cash flow and knowledge dictates the outcome. As Louis said, a bad cord can wreck it all.