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smartlad

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Playing on Top, in the Middle and the Back of the beat

« on: July 17, 2006, 03:23 AM »

I've just had a look at this lesson of Barts " Playing on Top, in the Middle and the Back of the beat" and I played along. I'm assuming that when you play on either side of the beat that you are creating a flam against the hi hat, and when your on it your in unison. Correct me if I'm wrong. The example I prefer is when the beat is down the middle, but I suppose it depends on the music. This can also be said of different sections of songs:- chorus in front of beat verse on the beat ect.


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felix

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Re: Playing on Top, in the Middle and the Back of the beat

« Reply #1 on: July 17, 2006, 07:04 AM »

If you have to keep it straight/even on one limb, you have to- no rules if it sounds and feels good.

I personally prefer pulling a "charlie watts" when I'm widening the pocket and I take the ride pattern out of the equation for the back beat.

When I push a tune I usually just push it- hands together.

Good question.


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Sonor, The Drummers Drum

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Re: Playing on Top, in the Middle and the Back of the beat

« Reply #2 on: July 17, 2006, 01:18 PM »

The higher the level, the more nuanced to the ear this will become. I would suggest Keith Carlock has mastered playing in back of the beat, but most people think of Carlock as being like a metronome -- right on top of it. If you listen closely, you can hear his bass drum often tugging ever so slightly at the tempo. That's why his pocket is so magical, I think!


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felix

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Re: Playing on Top, in the Middle and the Back of the beat

« Reply #3 on: July 17, 2006, 05:12 PM »

I'm going thru Fred Dinkin's book "It's about time" (Warner Bros. Publishing) now and there are plenty of examples in the book/CD's on how to do this as well as a discography of different drummers executing the groove behind, straight and pushing the beat.

Awesome book. Deceptively simple at first glance.

His approach is a "hands together, limbs together one"... endorsed by all the big groove drummers: Steve Ferrone, Marvin Smitty Smith, Harvey Mason, Ricky Lawson and others. Having excellent independence in the four limbs, being able to play with a click in the off beats and it dropping out are also emphasized.

Check it out.


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Sonor, The Drummers Drum

smartlad

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Re: Playing on Top, in the Middle and the Back of the beat

« Reply #4 on: July 17, 2006, 06:23 PM »

Thanks Felix, I'll check it out. What I tried today totally blew my mind, I set a click at 70bpm and started to play on top of the beat just using my sticks. Then what I did is play out of time purposely agianst the beat just speeding up and slowing down. After that I discovered I could use the beep of the metronome as grace note of the flam. This I implore all drummers to try its brilliant. I teaches you to play around the click and know where you are in conjunction with the time. Its so much fun!!! Cheesy