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Author Topic: Learning to read -- gotta do it -- turned out to be very cool  (Read 2158 times)
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Bill Fulton
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« on: July 18, 2006, 02:15 PM »

This has been around before, but it's to encourage new drummers to learn to read.
    My teacher transcribed a Peter Erskine lick I've been trying to figure out, in addition to showing me how to play it.  Once I heard it, I could easily see how the written music worked out.  SO, hey, why not try it some more?
   I got a copy of John Riley's Bop Drumming book, and started doing some exercises.  Tough at first, but the same deal... I can hear and see it. 
    So now I've learned two new rhythms from Riley's book, and I can read through his interdependence exercises, too.
    So why am I telling this?  A lot of guys figure that reading isn't cool or that it's boring.  But I found that it's as important as being able to learn to read written words.  There's a hell of a lot to learn and remember, but if you've got the book, you don't have to try to carry it around it your head.  And learning stuff from the Riley book is helping ALL my playing... very fun!
   
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« Reply #1 on: July 18, 2006, 02:48 PM »

Good for you Bill!!!!!!!!! Reading is so important to a full development on the drumkit, I am so thankfull that my first teacher many years ago forced me to learn as well. Keep at it man!!!!
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« Reply #2 on: July 18, 2006, 05:12 PM »

Very cool, Bill! When you can see the notation in your head as you play, that's when you know you've crossed that line and you've really absorbed it. Ironically, I think the more you learn about reading music, the easier it is to play things by ear.
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« Reply #3 on: July 18, 2006, 08:06 PM »

Thanks, guys... I'm actually pretty proud of it.  I too wish my first teacher had emphasized reading, and independence... but hey, that was then, this is now. I work on it a little bit every day.  A friend of mine, terrific jazz sax player, said his teacher told him if he spent twenty minutes a day working on reading, within six months he'd be able to sight read.  I think THAT's stretching it, but a little every day adds up.
    I also think it's generally improving my playing.  Trying to read new stuff, like the Bop book, has improved a lot of otherelements... while I'm working on something else. How cool is that??
   
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« Reply #4 on: July 18, 2006, 11:57 PM »

Reading is what has kept me in paycheques playing music. I'm reading several 1-hour long musical review shows a week and often have to sight read shows the day of. I'm so glad my father (a drummer) made me take piano lessons before he would teach me drums so that I could get a foundation in reading, harmony, and melody. Reading has been one of the most indispensible musical techniques I've ever learned.

But, I've found that at times I've become overdependent and overfocussed on the visual element, relying too much on the chart and not "hearing" what's happening around me. It's very important that you get the idea out of the chart/book/page and try to absorb it into your mind and body as quickly as possible so that you can shift your attention to the SOUND you're making. The most important parts of any chart aren't usually in the ink. Usually, the ink is just a sketch - you have to turn it into music.

Jim Blackley, a great jazz teacher and author who I study with now and again, has instructions listed for the chapters in his books. For instance, it might say,

1) Play all exercises this way.

2) Play all exercises that way.

3) etc...

4) etc...

5)GET YOUR NOSE OUT OF THE BOOK!

The value of that instruction cannot be understated.

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« Reply #5 on: July 19, 2006, 08:59 AM »

I've just started lessons with someone who has a computer monitor in front of the student kit.  The computer plays the music while the curser moves through the sheet music.  I have to read the music as it comes up and play in time with the drum track.

If I misread anything, or deviate even slightly from the beat, I'm immediately aware of it.  Without this arrangement, it's easy to kid myself that I'm doing great.

I'm hoping to have the same arrangement at home soon.


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« Reply #6 on: July 19, 2006, 10:38 AM »

A friend of mine, terrific jazz sax player, said his teacher told him if he spent twenty minutes a day working on reading, within six months he'd be able to sight read.  I think THAT's stretching it, but a little every day adds up.

FWIW, sight reading for a horn player and sight reading for a drummer aren't always the same exercises. A horn player computes every note and at the highest levels, they are also great interpreters of the music. They probably know some history of the composer and what the goal of the composition is supposed to be.

For drummers, the likelihood of being asked to sit down and read drum notation is about 1 in 1,000. Maybe less likely. I've never seen it, but I admit my professional experience is severely limited. You're more likely to get either a horn or keyboard part. I've seen a few vocal parts in my lifetime, too. One time I get a single line/four bars of notation rhythm, and that was very helpful, but I know to never count on that kind of help.

The most important thing for a drummer to understand about those charts is navigation. Because you won't likely be allowed the opportunity to read note-for-note, it becomes more of a challenge to know where you are at: verse/chorus/bridge/coda, or something to that effect. Drummers need to know how to navigate those charts primarily for things like transition fills, specified "horn hits," and how he/she will be moving along the song (ride cymbal on the chorus, tom-tom beat on the outro, etc.). Or even more common, you get a piece of paper with the song structure (A/B/A/B/C, etc) and some handwritten notes on what they want from the drummer. In Nashville studios and pro gigs, they often hand out something that looks like this: "1///4///5///1///" with a key at the top, which you are supposed to understand "C///F///G///C///" and that's 16 bars; a brief discussion usually takes place directly before playing about what the rhythm section will be doing.

Learning to read drum notation is important to your education and ability to communicate. It will accelerate exponentially the time it takes to learn anything. Unfortunately, only drummers read/speak drum notation.
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« Reply #7 on: July 19, 2006, 11:31 AM »

I disagree somewhat about the utility of being able to sightread well.  The last year or so I've started getting more and more calls to play in situations where there is music and little or no rehearsal.  My sightreading is not nearly where I'd like it to be, but is apparently good enough to get me through most of these gigs.

Most of the drum charts are fairly vague about what they want you to play, and leave a lot of room for interpretation of the groove, but sometimes the arranger has a definite idea of what he wants, and ability to decipher it quickly while playing is a definite plus.  Also, charts are not always written so as to be easily understood, so that the better you can read the faster you figure out what you have to do.

Playing in big bands has also inculcated the necessity of keeping your ears open while your eyes are on the music.  Otherwise you miss your opportunities to change your playing to better suit what's going on at the moment, and a lot of the accents and kicks are not going to be written in the music.  And if you're sightreading you need to listen to the band to know how the chart should feel.

Finally, while I like the idea mentioned above of the computerized music play along, to really become a good reader you have to get in the habit of looking ahead in the chart to see what's coming.  Otherwise you're going to be blindsided when you suddenly see "solo for 8 bars" or the notation for a complicated rhythm you're expected to play with the trumpets.  My band plays an arrangement that has a two beat rest for the whole band in the first measure of page three of my chart.  I'd be playing along (at around 180 bpm), get to the bottom of page two, jump up to the top of the next page, and wind up being the only one playing through the rest until I got smart and penciled in a warning to myself about four bars from the bottom of page two.
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« Reply #8 on: July 19, 2006, 12:53 PM »

Finally, while I like the idea mentioned above of the computerized music play along, to really become a good reader you have to get in the habit of looking ahead in the chart to see what's coming.

Absolutely.  That's the one big downside of the computer system.  Without a monstrous monitor, it's impossible to read ahead.  I wouldn't recommend that as the ONLY way to practice site reading, but it helps.

I have to ask, though, how can you guys site read music while playing the kit?  When I play woodwinds, the sheet music is right in front of me.  When I play a drum kit, I can't get the music that close.  So how do you cope with deciphering fly dropping from three feet away?

Also, every time I glance at my kit, I lose my place in the sheet music.  Do you guys learn to play your kit "blind", do you have amazing peripheral vision, or what?
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« Reply #9 on: July 19, 2006, 01:33 PM »

I have to ask, though, how can you guys site read music while playing the kit?  When I play woodwinds, the sheet music is right in front of me.  When I play a drum kit, I can't get the music that close.  So how do you cope with deciphering fly dropping from three feet away?

I always have a stand above my hi-hat, and there's no way that's three feet away. Maybe 18 inches?

If you don't have to read note-for-note, it's pretty easy to crunch what you have into 8-bar, 16-bar, and 32-bar segments. In most cases, I compile before hand and then turn away to use my ears. If I have a melody in front of me, sometimes I'll sing the melody to myself to help me keep track.

It's not that difficult to "read" when the music looks like this: http://www.smartassmusic.com/assets/pianohand.gif

The trick is deciphering something like this for drums:
http://home.schule.at/member/gnagflow/partituren/hauptbild.jpg
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« Reply #10 on: July 19, 2006, 02:06 PM »

I have to ask, though, how can you guys site read music while playing the kit?  When I play woodwinds, the sheet music is right in front of me.  When I play a drum kit, I can't get the music that close.  So how do you cope with deciphering fly dropping from three feet away?

Also, every time I glance at my kit, I lose my place in the sheet music.  Do you guys learn to play your kit "blind", do you have amazing peripheral vision, or what?

My music stand sits next to my hi hat.  I can play time and most fills without looking at my drums.  As you do it you figure out how to keep your place, although I do still get lost sometimes, especially when just playing time for 64 bars where every measure is written out.  I hate those.
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« Reply #11 on: July 19, 2006, 02:12 PM »

When I'm reading actual drum charts, I put my stand next to my hihat, but I look up at the band and/or bandleader frequently. When I'm just using cheat sheets, I usually tape them on the top of my bass drum.
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« Reply #12 on: July 19, 2006, 02:41 PM »

. . .

I have to ask, though, how can you guys site read music while playing the kit?  When I play woodwinds, the sheet music is right in front of me.  When I play a drum kit, I can't get the music that close.  So how do you cope with deciphering fly dropping from three feet away?
. . .

The stand usually goes near the high-hat, always within reach so I can turn pages.  It's also positioned between me and the conductor so I can see the baton with peripheral vision when not looking directly at him/her.
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« Reply #13 on: July 19, 2006, 02:57 PM »

When I'm just using cheat sheets, I usually tape them on the top of my bass drum.

I used to do this until I had a guitar tuner thrown at my head for glancing down at my BD one too many times. The guitarist thought I was bored and taking an indifferent stage presence (and not paying attention to him and his excellent band leadership). I was just looking to see how many times we repeated the chorus before hitting the bridge!
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« Reply #14 on: July 20, 2006, 10:28 AM »

see bill read.
read, bill, read!

see bill play.
play, bill, play!

see bill walk off with 20 more paying gigs coz he can read better than the next drummer.
GO, BILL!!
 
Grin

reading is fundamental, as they say. i am definitely getting better at it, though i struggled for a while coz i have a bit of symbol dyslexia. after a while, everything looks crazy to me. i take it in doses, and when i o.d., i just stop and pick it up again. i've found fatigue just magnifies dyslexia. another good trick is to cover portions of the page when it gets overwhelming. it's easier to progress when you compartmentalize information.
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Bill Fulton
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« Reply #15 on: July 20, 2006, 11:00 AM »

Woo-hoo! Thanks, Smoggrocks!

    I agree with what's said about charts in general. I did a stint with a local college/community big band, and I'd tape the songs at practices.  Then I'd make up my own charts A-A-B-A (then 4 bars trumpets)...etc.
  Saved my butt. SOOOO much easier than memorizing every song.
On the few songs that had "drum sheets", I ended up pencilling in the best hits, and  the A-A-B thing, and that  worked too.
    Still, with stuff like the Riley book, or trying to learn the "Elvin-isms" in Peter Erskine's books, the note for note reading is a great teacher.  And once I can play them easily, THEN I have to make it swing.
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« Reply #16 on: July 20, 2006, 12:09 PM »

I always have a stand above my hi-hat, and there's no way that's three feet away. Maybe 18 inches?

Ah... that's what I'm doing wrong.  From your description, I assume your music stand has a boom arm so the sheets are "above" the hi-hat.  Correct?  Are such stands readily available, or would I need to cobble one together from bits of hardware?
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« Reply #17 on: July 20, 2006, 12:24 PM »

Ah... that's what I'm doing wrong.  From your description, I assume your music stand has a boom arm so the sheets are "above" the hi-hat.  Correct?  Are such stands readily available, or would I need to cobble one together from bits of hardware?

I use a regular Manhasset stand.  I just pull it close to the hats, raise it so the bottom lip of the music stand is over the hats, and then tilt it back as necessary.  No boom.  Although you could probably rig one up if it was really necessary.
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« Reply #18 on: July 20, 2006, 03:36 PM »

Ah... that's what I'm doing wrong.  From your description, I assume your music stand has a boom arm so the sheets are "above" the hi-hat.  Correct?  Are such stands readily available, or would I need to cobble one together from bits of hardware?

No boom. I usually fit my stand in between the HH and 1st tom, assuming no one's laid any cables are anything that would tip the stand over. This is more complicated if you have more battery or a lot of cymbals to your left.

At one point in my life I saw a very cool clip stand that attached to the BD hoop and boomed upwards. Maybe I wouldn't do that to a wood hoop, but it would be a great thing to have otherwise. Anyone know of the manufacturer? Possibly custom made?
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« Reply #19 on: July 21, 2006, 08:14 AM »

On the floor or on the rack just to the left of my hihat and roughly level with same.

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« Reply #20 on: July 21, 2006, 08:57 AM »

On the floor or on the rack just to the left of my hihat and roughly level with same.



[Minor derail]

Nice set up Paul.  And being a turquoise kind of guy myself, I love the color.  Just wondering - what tunes do you do that call for the set of temple blocks?

[/Minor derail]
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« Reply #21 on: July 21, 2006, 10:03 AM »

The big band's leader has written several arrangements that call for temple blocks and we were going to perform one of them that day.  I've also hauled chimes and gong to gigs over the last few years.  The blocks aren't a normal part of the set, but I keep them handy.

Here's a chart that used all three.
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« Reply #22 on: July 24, 2006, 08:49 AM »

Very cool, Bill! When you can see the notation in your head as you play, that's when you know you've crossed that line and you've really absorbed it. Ironically, I think the more you learn about reading music, the easier it is to play things by ear.

Bill,
I think this is great and I support anyone that tries to better them selves.  I play by ear and have been doing it for 36 years.  I am reluctant to start learning how to read drum sheet music now.  I do read music but have never applied it to drumming.  Maybe I could learn too
but in the applications that I am involved in, I have never found a need for it.  My band stuff is done all by listening and my Church praise band is different.  My music director has handed me sheet music before but I told him all I need is the lyrics and I will make what ever notation that is needed for me to know what and where I am doing what.  He has been playing along time and keeps telling me that I play with more feeling than anyone he has ever played with.
I would hate to see that complement change.  Good luck and I hope it all makes you better.
Just to let you all know, I do respect all of you formally trained drummers and maybe because of my lack of training I am missing something that I could be doing better.  What I am doing seems to be working very well.  My band just split up after 4 years and right now, I have no shortage of good musicians to play with.  It is more about what chemistery will work best.
 
                                               Nutty

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« Reply #23 on: July 24, 2006, 08:52 AM »

On the floor or on the rack just to the left of my hihat and roughly level with same.



I love this kit.  Very nice.
                            Nutty
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« Reply #24 on: July 24, 2006, 10:44 AM »

Bill,
I think this is great and I support anyone that tries to better them selves.  I play by ear and have been doing it for 36 years.  I am reluctant to start learning how to read drum sheet music now.  I do read music but have never applied it to drumming.  Maybe I could learn too
but in the applications that I am involved in, I have never found a need for it.  My band stuff is done all by listening and my Church praise band is different.  My music director has handed me sheet music before but I told him all I need is the lyrics and I will make what ever notation that is needed for me to know what and where I am doing what.  He has been playing along time and keeps telling me that I play with more feeling than anyone he has ever played with.
I would hate to see that complement change.  Good luck and I hope it all makes you better.
Just to let you all know, I do respect all of you formally trained drummers and maybe because of my lack of training I am missing something that I could be doing better.  What I am doing seems to be working very well.  My band just split up after 4 years and right now, I have no shortage of good musicians to play with.  It is more about what chemistery will work best.
 
                                               Nutty



Nutty, I suggest you are reading music, and since you aren't a slave to drum notation, you're probably better at doing it professionally than a lot of guys who grew up being spoon fed the stuff through the Weckl books and what not.
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« Reply #25 on: July 24, 2006, 11:08 AM »

Nutty,

FWIW, it's not to late until your 6 ft under.  Smiley  I would recommend starting off with Mark Wessels book; you can check it out on vicfirth.com.  It's pretty basic and includes music for you to play along wiht.  I use it for my begining students before "moving up the ladder."

If your drumming pleases you and others, learning to read will broaden your horizons.

Chris (Rhythmist)
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« Reply #26 on: July 24, 2006, 05:51 PM »

Nutty, I suggest you are reading music, and since you aren't a slave to drum notation, you're probably better at doing it professionally than a lot of guys who grew up being spoon fed the stuff through the Weckl books and what not.

Thank you Gaddabout,
I guess that you are looking at it as the glass is half full.  I really do play with feeling more than anything else and since I sing too, I key my changes on the vocals.  I do depend on a music stand most of the time.  It has nothing but lyrics and my notations but I usually am the one driving the bus so it works out very well.

Thank You Chris C,
You are right, it is not to late.  I have really been giving it some thought.  I have a great drummer friend in Louisville that I really respect and some training from him might be good.
I have been compared to him and he really knows what he is doing, I guess, I don't.  When I am doing Open mic night with all of my friends that are active musicains in town, When they tell me,"man that was killer", I kind of blow it off like, "yea, 36 years and I still don't know what I am doing". The Guitar player from the house band heard me say that and he said "Yes you do too know what you are doing".  He also plays with a few other bands in town.
I am really not sure what I want to do training wise but I love playing and will keep on playing as long as my health let's me play.
                                         Nutty
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« Reply #27 on: July 27, 2006, 10:47 AM »

Nutty, I suggest you are reading music, and since you aren't a slave to drum notation, you're probably better at doing it professionally than a lot of guys who grew up being spoon fed the stuff through the Weckl books and what not.

Why would you assume that having no formal training would make one a better drummer?  Do you assume that everyone who's reading charts is a "slave to drum notation?"

I think we do most of our learning, especially as it relates to pop music and jazz, on the bandstand, and the best asset is often a good pair of ears.  That said, as a practical matter being able to read music can be a big boost to a musical career, and is an incomparable aid in communicating with other musicians.

I'm really dismayed sometimes by the implied lack of respect for musical education expressed here by the self taught, as if some musical tools are not only unnecessary but a hindrance.  Just because you've done well without formal training doesn't mean you wouldn't have done better with it.
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