drumnut1
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« Reply #40 on: November 28, 2006, 08:41 AM » |
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Ted Nugent 1984. Felt like Cotton in my ears for a week. Nutty
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"You are only as good as the people you surround yourself with'. "I love The Cafe. "If there is music today, it is a great day". "Tama Star Classics and Paiste cymbals for ever" !!!
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felix
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« Reply #41 on: November 28, 2006, 01:29 PM » |
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How many bands I see- national acts, where the music is so stinking loud. Time and time again.
I wish and hope for the day in which that trend will stop.
*If it's too loud you are too old!*
Seriously, one pays all that money for a show and you have to put foam in your ears just to stand it? That is a joke! We have a killer jazz/fusion venue here in town that I am going to have to hang out in more, because most rock concerts I go to now are just too loud.
The FOH engineers must all be deaf. I don't know how they can stand it.
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Sonor, The Drummers Drum
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HDT
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Rock stars... is there anything they don't know?
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« Reply #42 on: November 28, 2006, 01:41 PM » |
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I've started to reply to this thread several times, and ended up cutting it off each time, because (for one thing) I was afraid I would end up writing a book and put everyone to sleep. So I will try to keep it brief. Is live music dead? No, I don't think so, but here in southwest Missouri it seem like it is just sputtering along. Over the years, Springfield has been the launch pad for a number of national acts and individual musicians who have gone on to greater glory. As others have noted, the local music scene occasionally heats up, and a band or two will survive and rise to the level of local heros, and inevitably move away to hopefully tap into a larger market. It's the curse of a midsize city But something that happened in our most recent election dealt a serious blow to our (already fragile) local music scene. Greene County and the city of Springfield already have DWI laws with teeth... and that's a good thing. I don't want drunk drivers on the road any more than the next guy, but about a year ago, the County and City created a DWI Task Force, and immediately began a campaign focused on closing bars to anyone under 21. Period. And their campagn worked. With the help of a few well-placed local law enforcement officials, the Greene County DWI Task Force managed to convince a majority of Springfield voters that "for the sake of the children (I.e. college age "children") we must eliminate the evil of underage drinking from our community... as if by keeping under 21 college students out of bars, they will cease to drink. Yeah, right. Almost every bar in this city already had a system in place to accomodate under 21 patrons. And from all accounts, most of the time, it was very effective. Young people got to go to bars and enjoy live entertainment in an environment where it was very unlikely they could get their hands on a beer, or any other drink stronger than a Diet Pepsi. Young local bands, on their way up, (and the bars that they play in)depend on the loyalty, enthusiasm and $$ that college students and the under 21 crowd provide. Now that that has been eliminated, it will be interesting to see what happens. Too many voters simply didn't see that angle of the issue, didn't care, or felt that the under-age drinking issue was more important than the possible impact it could have on the local "entertainment industry". Time will tell, but I know if I was 20 years old and in a band just starting out, I sure wouldn't waste my time trying to generate a local fan base, when I could go to Kansas City, St. Louis, Memphis... where thay actually embrace and encourage local musicians. That is why I am not feeling very hopeful about the local music scene. I hope I am wrong. Peace.
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"We're going bowling... if we don't come back, avenge our deaths." Homer Simpson
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drumwild
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« Reply #43 on: November 28, 2006, 02:59 PM » |
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Living in California as a teen in the '60's I saw the Creams, Hendrixs, Stones, Airplanes, Deads, Doors ...blah-blah-blah
The clubs in LA on the Sunset Strip still reference bands like The Doors as their claim to fame. No mention of anyone from the 70s, 80s, 90s or recently, tho. The 00s (Odies) are almost over, too. Heard some girl teen "band" (probably 4 or 5 girls who just "sing") being interviewed. I think of them only because they probably perform live without a band or maybe lipsync. Q: Do you think The Pussycat Dolls send the wrong message to young girls? A: They don't speak to the young girls cuz they are old. It's our generation. Q: What do you think of Paris Hilton? A: Ohmygawd! Paris Hilton is like SO talented!
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smoggrocks
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I'm trying to think, but nothing happens.
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« Reply #44 on: November 28, 2006, 03:39 PM » |
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...[like Indiana.] Growing up there, I had two choices for entertainment. It was checking out the band playing at the Lodge or watching the grass grow. we used to love playing more 'okie' type towns because the kids were so jazzed to see a hard rock band [from New York, no less]. it seemed there were more venues for live music in the smaller towns upstate, in connecticut, and jersey. we targeted those places for a long time. it was always much more fruitful than playing in nyc for a bartender and one dame with a vacuous look in her eyes. alas, that, too, seems to be going the way of the vhs recorder. 
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Taking time from the overload and showerin' with reason -- Smogg Obstacles are what we choose to see when we lose sight of our goals. -- Paul Stanley
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Danno
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« Reply #45 on: November 28, 2006, 06:01 PM » |
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Ted Nugent 1984. Felt like Cotton in my ears for a week. Nutty
I saw the Motor City Madman back in the seventies and had EXACTLY the same experience. Loudest show I've ever been to.
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Christopher
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That's MR. Colaiuta to you...
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« Reply #46 on: November 28, 2006, 10:41 PM » |
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I was talked into going to see a new band last week by a friend of mine. Army of AnyoneGlad I went. Killer show. Guitarist and bass player from Stone Temple Pilots, singer from Filter and David Lee Roth's most recent drummer, Ray Luzier. Solid hard rock. You'll be hearing allot about these guys soon if you haven't already. Live music aint dead. Keith Richards on the other hand.... 
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"What one man can do, another can do." -Charles Morse (Anthony Hopkin's character from the 1997 movie, The Edge)
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Vintage Ludwig
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« Reply #47 on: November 28, 2006, 10:47 PM » |
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Is it possible some of us went to a Ramones concert and just went deaf? Maybe we've been surrounded by live music we just can't hear it.
I know it took me about a week to recover.
NICE! Saw the Ramones in 1989 at a small club on Broadway ave. in the strip club section of San Francisco. It was the LOUDEST show I have ever heard. Absolutely rocked 
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robyn
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« Reply #48 on: November 29, 2006, 12:04 PM » |
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How many bands I see- national acts, where the music is so stinking loud. Time and time again.
I wish and hope for the day in which that trend will stop.
*If it's too loud you are too old!*
Seriously, one pays all that money for a show and you have to put foam in your ears just to stand it? That is a joke! We have a killer jazz/fusion venue here in town that I am going to have to hang out in more, because most rock concerts I go to now are just too loud.
This is exactly why I rarely go to a live show. It's almost always so loud that you can't really hear the music--at that level it just turns into noise. robyn
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Life is as dear to the mute creature as it is to man. Just as one wants happiness and fears pain, just as one wants to live and not to die, so do other creatures. ~ The Dalai Lama
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PJSdrum
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« Reply #49 on: November 29, 2006, 02:16 PM » |
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I really think a lot of this relates to the era you are familiar with. I have some much older musician friends who are now in their seventies who tell me about the days when every hotel and restaurant had bands nitely not too mention gigging for social events, etc. It was not uncommon for them to play two or even three venues per day. Even a musician of modest talent could probably make a decent living if he put the effort in. That era is LONG Dead. When I was a young guy in the late sixties it seemed like there were always opportunities to play and even get some modest pay. Lots of churches or youth centers and park districts had weekly dances or sock hops. High schools regularly hired local bands to play for dances at least once a month so you could make a circuit of several schools and be sure of working once or twice a week at a minimum. As I got more involved in the actual business of music and got more versatile I frequently played for two or three social events each weekend like weddings, Bar Mitzvahs, corporate events, and so on. Then of course there were still a good amount of bars and clubs hiring bands and competing with each other to bring in better talent to attract crowds. Compare that to a bar owner who told my band recently that he doesn't hire bands anymore because they don't bring in the crowd. He said he could do better by putting a free keg of beer in what used to be the dance floor and just make money off the people buying liquor. Yes, there is still a place for live music but it seems to me there are less and less opportunities for young musicians to hone their craft and learn the business aspects of performance. So, as I say, it's a matter of historical perspective but in general I would have to say that the scene for live music is in pretty sad shape. I used to keep a log of all my gigs and some years I was playing well over a hundred gigs. That wasn't all that long ago. I haven't kept track the last several years since my move to a new location but I can tell you that my numbers are nowhere near that anymore.
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Peter Stoltman
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Tae
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Let there be rock.
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« Reply #50 on: November 29, 2006, 07:16 PM » |
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There is a skatepark about 20 minutes from where I live that was just recently built. It includes a park, rock climbing wall, basketball, and a lot of other attractions. There is also a section called "The Foundry". It includes a non-alcoholic bar, booths and a stage. Many local bands come and play there, as well as larger bands. I have been to a few concerts before I started going there and I enjoyed them. Now that I have started experiencing live music I've come to enjoy it. Not just the music, but the environment of it as well. So, to me live music isn't dead.
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"When I first started playing, I was interested in music and I was able to read it. But when I moved into playing with groups, I did a silly thing and dropped it. I do think it's great to be able to write down ideas in music form. But I also think that feeling is a lot more important in drumming than mere technique." John (Bonzo)
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KEW
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« Reply #51 on: December 04, 2006, 08:44 PM » |
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I agree that live music is in decline because of new laws and technology but I disagree that it’s a new phenomenon. My Grandfather told me stories about how hard it was for live musicians when he was young because the jukebox had just been invented and a lot of clubs dropped matinees and only ran live music at night. From my experience a lot of bands went under in the middle ‘70’s when clubs jumped on the Disco fad. Live music comes and goes. Two of the best times for live music were the ‘20s and ‘60s, both times of social upheaval. If that happens again, live music will be back as strong as ever.
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"In the end everythings a gag."...Charlie Chaplin
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Danno
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« Reply #52 on: December 04, 2006, 09:14 PM » |
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I agree that live music is in decline because of new laws and technology but I disagree that it’s a new phenomenon. My Grandfather told me stories about how hard it was for live musicians when he was young because the jukebox had just been invented and a lot of clubs dropped matinees and only ran live music at night. From my experience a lot of bands went under in the middle ‘70’s when clubs jumped on the Disco fad. Live music comes and goes. Two of the best times for live music were the ‘20s and ‘60s, both times of social upheaval. If that happens again, live music will be back as strong as ever.
I think that's the smartest post in this thread. Interesting, too.
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Chip71
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« Reply #53 on: December 05, 2006, 06:06 AM » |
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Two of the best times for live music were the ‘20s and ‘60s, both times of social upheaval. If that happens again, live music will be back as strong as ever.
I had an uncle who made a similar comment..... He said, "Did you ever notice throughout history how a nation thrives in a time of war?" I don't want to be political at all, but I played the most gigs during the Viet Nam era. It's sad how the worst of times can bring the best of times. I'm not exactly "dancing in the streets" over that thought. 
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"When you quit learning you start dieing"-My Grandfather
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Bart Elliott
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« Reply #54 on: December 05, 2006, 10:06 AM » |
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I can remember when the first drum-machine was invented. People said it would put every drummer out of business. I can remember hearing other drummers talk about how worried they were with the drum-machine being used. There were a small handful of level-headed musicians who knew better and were the first ones to embrace the drum-machine and use it as a tool to compliment, not replace. I know that I'm not freaking out about technology or live music. When I see a hurdle, I just look for creative ways to work with it or around it. Complaining and worrying will not add one day to our lives nor will it make things better.  War and conflict does (typically) bring unity and oneness within a culture. When we can unite under a similar cause, there's strength. The Drummer Cafe is what it is because we all come together to share and celebrate a common cause ... the art of drumming. Certainly life/death types of causes will bring a stronger bond and unity, but the concept is the same. I still stand by my predictions.
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Life is a beauty contest; whatever wins your heart ... wins your life.
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drumnut1
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« Reply #55 on: December 05, 2006, 10:34 AM » |
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I can remember when the first drum-machine was invented. People said it would put every drummer out of business. I can remember hearing other drummers talk about how worried they were with the drum-machine being used. There were a small handful of level-headed musicians who knew better and were the first ones to embrace the drum-machine and use it as a tool to compliment, not replace. I know that I'm not freaking out about technology or live music. When I see a hurdle, I just look for creative ways to work with it or around it. Complaining and worrying will not add one day to our lives nor will it make things better.  War and conflict does (typically) bring unity and oneness within a culture. When we can unite under a similar cause, there's strength. The Drummer Cafe is what it is because we all come together to share and celebrate a common cause ... the art of drumming. Certainly life/death types of causes will bring a stronger bond and unity, but the concept is the same. I still stand by my predictions. Hi Bart, This was a great post and I was one of those guys that was worried about being replaced by drum machines. I did know that there were things we could do as humans that the machine could never pull off. Then I saw Herbie Hancock play with a drummer and a drum machine and they were really complementing each other. The band I was playing in back then was doing a bunch of funk, Morris Day, Prince, Phil Collins, music from Heavy Metal like Three Lock box and we bought a drum machine and it made the Funky grooves better and made me a better drummer. It is like playing with a metronome all the time. Your post was very well said and spoken like a true Philosopher. I think that most people would rather see a live show then watch it on TV. There is a certain element that you only get by being there? I think that KEW had some very good points also. Nutty
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"You are only as good as the people you surround yourself with'. "I love The Cafe. "If there is music today, it is a great day". "Tama Star Classics and Paiste cymbals for ever" !!!
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KEW
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« Reply #56 on: December 05, 2006, 11:30 AM » |
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I think that's the smartest post in this thread. Interesting, too.
I use the million monkey theory of writing. I just keep posting and posting and the law of averages says that sooner or later I’ll write something intelligent just by chance.  Bart’s advice is right on the money. Being able to change with the times and adapt to new technology is one of the best assets a working musician can have. I started working professionally as a teenager because the ‘50s drummers in my area didn’t keep up and couldn’t play the British invasion stuff that took over in the sixties. I changed from a rock drummer to a funk drummer in ’75 to stay working. And I bought a drum machine program for my Apple IIe in the 80’s to learn how to program drums. There was a post awhile back about the best piece of advice to give to young drummers. I’d say it’s “don’t be a one trick pony.” (Warning: vague Steve Gadd reference).
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"In the end everythings a gag."...Charlie Chaplin
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hockeyguy
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« Reply #57 on: December 05, 2006, 04:01 PM » |
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I live near the Baltimore area and there is a ton of gigs available for my cover band. The bands playing covers stay pretty busy, but so do a lot of the original bands. The thing I find is that we're doing a lot of bars and not many clubs for cover bands where there is a stage set up with house production. Mostly the original acts are booked in those rooms. Whatever. So yes, there is a ton of live music around here. Of course some is better than others, but it's there. now I don't EVER get out to see bands since I have a wife and two young kids, but I'm playing between 3 and 5 times a month so if I'm out in a bar it's because I'm playing music, not watching it... Before the kids, we used to go out every weekend. Wish I could catch some groups and have them entertain me every now and then.
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eardrum
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« Reply #58 on: December 07, 2006, 01:21 AM » |
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............now I don't EVER get out to see bands since I have a wife and two young kids, but I'm playing between 3 and 5 times a month so if I'm out in a bar it's because I'm playing music, not watching it......... Now there's a couple of very cool reasons for not getting out to see bands.... Sure beats being sick, having to work 2 or 3 desk jobs, running from the law, etc.. It's great that you're in a area where you and others can keep busy playing.
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jnyman
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« Reply #59 on: December 24, 2006, 05:50 PM » |
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Hey some good thoughts in this thread!
I will address the DJ issue a bit... though, as an old fart, I would take a "DJ's get off the bandstand" sticker... and put it next to "The Big Bands Are Coming Back!!"
pop music is often about taste and particulars, not virtuosity. Punk, when it was the new pop, proved this. Not too hard to play, the clothes were easy to pick out/make, and the themes were popular amongst lots of yute of that era/the next era/any era.
so you could start a band, cop the sounds, the 'tude, and do entertaining shows that featured THE 'GOOD TASTE AND PARTICULAR ELEMENTS' of the (popular) day.
modern music, such as hip-hop, is built upon VERY SPECIFIC sounds, samples, synthesized licks. HARD for a 4 or 5 piece band to cop. The rhythms are tight, not sloppy; the specificity of the grooves would be VERY DIFFICULT to play by a human on a drumset, for example (how many adam deitch and ?Loves do we have?). How many snares would you need? etc. And then, on TOP of that, the 'singing' is either a rap comprised of VERY SPECIFIC VOCAL ATTITUDES and RHYTHMS, or often a really good singer (such as Christina A, for example).
These elements are DIFFICULT for a 'live band' to recreate.
But a DJ can play them through a great-sounding system, and mix them with a list of other, importantly popular tunes, so that the people (who are there, always, for their own entertainment) can have a good time dancing to good-sounding things they like. An audience only ever cares that a performer bring them what they want-- and most folks in a bar want to dance and be distracted, NOT be moved to artistic spaces of emotion.
in other words, the DJ does the job BETTER than a band. I don't understand why I rarely hear bands say that. You know, "He packed the dance floor. We didn't. Maybe we need to change somethings...?"
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