Badge of honor...  You mean badge of bologne.  Get over yourself folks.  If I was hiring someone and they boasted about how they did it all on their own, blah, blah, blah, and never needed, nor needs to seek help, they would be out of there.  That is a sure fire way to lock yourself into a creative corner.  The reason?... Because your creative energy is driven by what you know only, rather than what your truly capable of.

With that... Seek help.  Even if you've spent an enormous amount of time and energy convincing yourself your good.

I need Theropy and a persciption of Effexer. Am I  depressed?  Look, I don't care if I am good or not!!! I just play drums cause I love it!!! I don't even understand what you are refering to with your badges and your bologne sandwich. No one has boasted about being self taught on this intire thread.
Please get some help your self!!! By the way, I will let you in on a little secrete, I am not "Self Taught". No one is?
                                            Nutty

Hi mandocaster,
Yes it is a good thing and can be a bad thing too. Ego is what drives us in different ways. It is just bad to show to much of it.  You are right, I don't have stage fright even when I don't know what I am doing anymore.  I just play drums. We are doing a trip to the Womans prison with the Praise team and I don't know half the music.  This is where being proficient at reading would be very benificial but I have to just play drums and I have gotten to the point that if I mess up they won't remember it for more than a few seconds any way. There really is no short cut to playing well. Playing drums well doesn't just come with lessons from a great teacher, it comes from every thing you put into it.  I tell guitar players, "if you really want to be the best you can be with the guitar, you need to wake up and grab the guitar and you need to go to bed with it in your hands also".  I think that drummers are the same. I have to say that, "The Magic Shortcut to Better Playing" is using all your resources and putting the time into it your self.  If you are not willing to spend the time then you will not be all you can be!! I am not a rocket scientist or a percussion perfessor but I think that any action that requires work  to get what you expect out of it. There is no magic other than hard work!!!!
                               Nutty

Unless an instrumentalist learned to play without ever hearing a recording or performance of any music, that person is not self-taught. Hell, there are a lot of private instructors that just run "monkey see, monkey do" lessons as it is.

Playing from the heart and using good technique are not mutually exclusive. I play from the heart; I just use an ever-expanding tool set to do so. Being humble enough to seek instruction regardless of your playing level is a healthy habit. That Randy Rhodes story was great.

I totally agree.  During my first 6 years of learning drums, I took private lessons from a wonderful big band drummer ( Jack Morrison ), who was just mentioned in the hall of fame for marching drummers.  He taught me all of the rudiments, reading, writing, etc.  Now, after 27years of playing, I still continue to learn from books and still remind myself that there is sooooo much to learn.  So many avenues to experiment with.  The possibilities are infinite.

Don't know who used this term first but I did use it in a post on this thread and it seems to me the point (at least my point) is being missed.  I don't personally know any musicians who are claiming a "badge of honor" for themselves.  However, over and over, I've heard this "badge" being applied to musicians who are self taught by others - could be their mothers who know nothing about music or could be an accomplished musician.  "Oh and did you know - they are self taught - my, my, my"...  The fact is, that when someone plays at a high level and didn't go through the normal schooling they are given this "badge" by others - whether you like it or not and whether the musician themselves like it or not.  It's just a fact of life and it is noteworthy (I'm not talking about the kid down the street - I'm talking about accomplished, REAL, musicians).  Martin Taylor, one of the greatest jazz guitarist out there (IMHO) blew a bunch of Berklee students away at a clinic once - someone had transcibed a solo, brought it up to him for comments. He informed them that it was all greek, he never learned to read music.      I don't see him self applying a badge and just as nutty says, I haven't seen anyone here proclaiming the virtues of learning in a vacuum but I don't know how anyone can NOT be impressed when someone achieves a high level of musicianship without rigorous schooling.  To me this simply speaks to the amazing musical gifts some have been given and is something wonderful to enjoy, not argue about.

You've chosen to ignore the many posts from regular Cafe contributors stating quite clearly that no one is prejudiced against self taught players.

There is an issue and only ONE issue.
When posts appear on the forum requesting advice for some technical problem, or worse still, a physical injury due to the act of drumming, and when experienced drummers have suggested seeking professional help (usually in the form of a lesson or two), one or two questioners have rejected that advice out of hand. The assortment of excuses being, I can't find a teacher, I can't afford any lessons, or I'm self taught and don't feel the need to involve any one else in my development.
It's no use people saying they haven't come across this attitude either. I've been a member for four years and have read posts with these attitudes several times.
You've been vocal with your opinions Nutty, but still no Cafe member (with a reasonable attitude) is against you or the drummer you are. Why should they be? Because we aren't as a community against self taught musicians. We are simply dismayed by drummers who wont seek proper help when a problem arises they can't deal with themselves.
Some of us are starting to wonder whether it is worth our time persuading them otherwise. Simple as that.

Dang.  Sorry.  Looks like the site is gone. 

Too bad - you would have loved it!

Wow.

What a great thread. And like Drumnut I like the people here, respect them, and have learned a ton from them.

Tony, I think your original post was right on the money.

Chris,
Again, you have chosen to ignore that I state that I am not self taught.
You are absolutly right because people like dea keep coming up with the badge of honor crap.  I have never said that you or any of the senior members have ever been disrespectful at all. I could see one get very irritated with giving the same advice over and over again.  I never asked anyone how to hold my sticks. How to set up my cymbals.  Why my wrist hurt like Gadd is talking about. I am sure there are post like that but they never came from me.  I have more asked about stuff like "the drummes roll with a priase band and how to deal with the worship leader that controls time" Or I left Aquarian and wanted advice on Evans heads? I never asked any one to teach me to play drums.  How to play a bass drum or a hi hat
or what a dotted quarter note is. I learned to read music as a child.
I am not asking you all to teach me to play. I do that just fine myself.
Refering to my friend Dave's post about having all the answers and I understand after being asked these things over and over again, it gets old. I have never asked you guys and gals these type of questions.
As Gadd was saying, it is about who is making money at their trade and who is not.  I do make money playing drums.  It is not my sole income but I have been getting paid to play music since I was a teenager. I was pretty bad back then and I look back and find it hard to believe that I was getting paid but I was. As far as my history of drumming.  My father was a doctor and didn't support me playing drums.  My mother was nice enough to buy me a kit when I turned 9.  We lived out in the middle of no where.
This was all the support I got.  They wanted me to sing, not drum.  So I was aloud to practice only when they were not in the house or when gone out for the evening. When we moved into town I was 16.  I was growing my hair half way down my back getting involved in everything but education.  At 18 I joined the Navy.  I didn't play for a marching band,
take private lessons, major in music in college.  I just wanted to play drums. I wish I had the resources that some of you had but my folks did'nt support me drumming. Now my mother looks at what I have accomplished with them and says "I should have gotten you some formal training back then, you might have really done something more with all this".  She is right
but I am 46 years old now.  Now, I have some resources.  Now I am trying to get better with some training.  I am a sponge trying to soak up information that I should have gotten 30+ years ago. You guys are absolutly right when you tell people that want these answers to go find a teacher. I will never dispute that.  That is the best advice you can give.
Maybe they can talk the parents into supporting what they want to do.
Like Danno said "Wow.

What a great thread. And like Drumnut I like the people here, respect them, and have learned a ton from them".

This statement says it all, I read posts on here and soak up information.
I don't disrespect any of you.  Where else could I read words of wisdom from Chris Whitten and Gaddabout's back and forth converstations? Where else could I read advice from Keith Cronin and Bart, and Bermuda.  Where else could I make friends with this many experienced drummer like Dave, Felix, Larry, eardrum, Danno, Hannah, quicksfoot, Chip71, Louis, and many more? This place is great.  .
                                      Nutty