I'm the drummer in a 4 piece band.  I also own all the sound equipment (monitors, mains, board, snake, power amps) except that each member brings his own microphone & stand...so basically, I do all of the sound.

This has been an ongoing issue...and now that I just expanded my equipment to a 24-ch. board, 2 new power amps, and 15" subs...the work involved is ALOT.  Keep in mind, I still setup my equipment (drumkit) and play the gig!

The rest of the band has no knowledge of sound equipment or how to set it up.  They basically arrive, get out their amps/guitars/mic's, and play the show.  Once in a while, they'll help lift a speaker, but nothing major.

The aggrevating part is, when it comes time to cash in, everyone gets paid the same amount.  I feel as though I'm being totally ripped off.  On average, I'll setup for 2.5 hours, teardown for 1.5 hours, and play for 3 hours.  That's 7 hours of work, not including the load/unload time from the house to the car/van.  That's another hour each way.  A grand total of 9 hours for a 3 hour show.

The other musicians play for 3 hours and setup/teardown for 15 minutes each.  Approx. 4 hours with load/unload from house.

I'm considering "charging" for my time/equipment (not to mention insurance for broken equipment).  I was thinking, the average soundman gets between $200 and $300 for a 3-4 hour show.  I was thinking, charging $150 to $175...kinda cutting the band a little break.

Does this seem right?

Obviously, renting sound/PA equipment locally for a gig would mean deducting that cost from total pay...and then of course splitting the rest.  Just because I own the stuff, why should it be any different?

I have a feeling the band members will be mad...but should I just tell it like it is?

I doubt if your bandmates are intentionally ripping you off; I suspect they're just clueless (and probably just a little selfish).

Every band I've ever known has all pitched-in together, unless there was a sound tech, road crew, etc.

Have you asked them for help with set-up/tear-down? If not, why not?

I wouldn't recommend that you ask for a "fee" for your time/gear; I'd recommend that you ask for discussion to resolve the problem.

This can be a touchy situation.  I do a lot of small time sound and play out quite a bit too.  If I am hired to do sound that is all I do.  If I am hired to play that is all I do, but occasionally I agree to furnish a small PA (free of charge) for a group when I play.  If we are playing a larger venue we need a full time soundman.  I have 10,000 watts FOH and 5,500 available for monitors.  If that system is needed there is a charge and I must approve of the engineer.  I don't trust just anyone tweeking my knobs!     This subject comes up a lot and there is no easy answer.  The best option would be an agreement when the group was formed or you were hired.  It is very hard to change horses in the middle of the stream and more often that not all that happens is a lot of hard feelings.  However, I do feel it would be better to have a discussion with the other members and talk about how the work/money is divided rather than let it bother you without saying anything.  You may lose the gig but IMO that is better than holding your feelings inside. 

Every point made here is valid and make total sense.
Unfortunately, it's a very touchy subject and the subject will probably create real ill feelings when you approach it, so proceed with caution.

I too had similar issues, not so much the hauling of the speakers and heavy gear, but the upkeep, hookup, setting, wiring, and operation of the soundgear. In all honesty I wish I would have never even indicated that I knew how to do this type of stuff. I should have just acted ignorant. Every time someone didn't like the monitor sound, or there was feedback it became MY issue.  Trying to get others to give me their undivided attention for 15 minutes so I could soundcheck was like pulling teeth.  While I set the stuff up, everyone else chilled at the bar or did their own thing.  Like you and others here, it makes you feel really used.
After one tiring, long show that we had extra gear at due to the size of the room, I went to start packing up. No one helped me at all, all to busy at the bar. Even after the big gear was done, while trying to get the wires rolled and stowed, I had to literally argue with bandmembers to get their guitars and amps off the wires so I could keep packing. That was the final straw.
The conversation was simple. After I took my P.A. stuff home that night I told the band leader in a very calm and non threating way the next day that I was selling it, I'm done fighting everone, doing the work and getting no help. Either hire a sound company from now on, compensate me to do the work, or make everyone do a fair share.  The next gig I showed up with no outboard gear, I set up my drums and mikes. Eventually the others got the signal, set up the board and speakers.  It was toucy because they had to scramble for wires (oops, I no longer was in charge of providing the wires or wiring) they had no EQ on monitors, no effects,  it was a tough night  But the message was loud and clear.     

Now...you have to take the fact that you have lot's of drums to set up out of the picture.  That is your issue, you choose to play the drums instead of the harmonica. You understood the consequence of having to move the drum gear.  That is our lot in life as drummers. you can not use the lots of drums argument in your defense.  Other band members also can not use their own gear in their defense.  Glad I don't play a Hammond B-3. I ask for no help hauling my gear, and I offer no help to others on their gear.
Secondly, work they do on promotion, booking, mailers, websites is appreciated and everyone should do a fair share of work.  But that is NOT back breaking labor that has to be crunched in before and after playing a show.  We pay our lead singer 5% to handle all bookings, collecting fees, working out deals, pays his cell phone.  It's worth every cent to just stick out our hands at the end of the show, get our cash and not worry about details.  Plus it's less then a manager and gives him motivation  to keep us steady working.

It is a issue of cooperation on the P.A.  EVERYONE has to pull their weight, or others will feel slighted. If it's a matter of a physical restriction to lifting or carrying, there is the candidate to run wires. Everyone has to have a assigned task, it then becomes routine and goes real fast. The idea of crosstraining is good as it makes it easier if one person is sick, late or leaves the band,.

A fund should be set aside of maybe $ 40.00 per show to be prepared for equipment failure, upgrades and replacing. Set a cap to the fund so after there's $ 1000.00 in the fund you can stop kickin in.  Make it an understanding that if a person leaves the band they get their portion on UNUSED funds back. It's a tough book keeping system. But can be done.  I have sent ex bandmembers checks for $300 + for their shares. You would be surprised on how good it looks to show your honesty when they get their money back.

If you can't agree to a shared responsability & equipment ownership you have to insist on fair compensation for equipment rental and cartage. Maybe you and 1 other band member can handle it for an extra $ 50.00 per show. It's a lot less then a sound company would be.

Was I able to solve all our problem.. NO  but I no longer haul the board, racks and wires, I've delegated the running of the board to the bass player, and I help out more then my fair share.  We share (or I should say, most of us share) in the workload, we put a few bucks aside for gear repair and things are a bit smoother.
 
Your issue needs to be addressed,  The others need to see the value of the service  you are providing to them and be willing to help or compensate you. If they can't see that, or are that selfish to not care about your feelings you need to really consider the situation and maybe move on.
 
 sorry 'bout the novel. but you hit a real nerve.






 

You may find that the other band members are willing to shell out a few extra bucks each out of their pay for you, so they don't have to do any work. Thats if payment is the preffered solution.  If someone offered to tear down, pack up and load all my gear for $10.00 I would jump on it.   

If you continue to do the work and say nothing, you give the impression that you accept that situation as is.  It's totally your call, if you don't like the way it is going, open your mouth, rest your back and solve the problem once and for all.

I am in agreement with Wolfgang,  good work ethics always pay off in the long haul, but make everyone show the same good ethics. The promoter recognizing his ethics, is a real nice comment.  But it also means he recognized the bad ethics of the other band members. I'm sure that will be in his mind when he considers the band for another gig. 

Thanks for all the ideas & thoughts.

Keep in mind, our original situation was the singer/guitarist owning 50% of the equipment (board, mains, snake), and I owned the other 50% (power amps, monitors, and knowledge to operate all very efficiently).  I'd set it up, and we'd play.  There was no "extra" for me or him, because the bassist owned the van.  I'd have to say, other then them not physically helping during a show (or VERY little), the workload was fair...maybe except for the lead guitarist who didn't do sh*t...but was also the bassist's brother.

Now, the singer/guitarist sold everything and is not even in the band anymore.

So...

I ended up talking with the bass player about this issue.  I proposed that he and the others just show up 40 minutes before the show to load in (amps, guitars, vocal mics) and then I'd take care of the rest.  He gave me a very negative attitude, and told me that "he wouldn't help me with 1 thing...at all".  I told him that's what I wanted (because, often enough, the other members are just in the way with guitars, amps, and themselves...not to mention that they are asking me 1000 questions while I'm trying to run everything!)

I told him that I was tired of people not doing anything, and if he owned the stuff and did what I do, he would understand.  It took a while, but he eventually understood.  I explained that one of my power amps went sour after the last show, and I fronted $70 for repair out of my own pocket.

Plus, this particular show that we're doing, he ends up making just as much money as he normally would because we got a last-minute pay raise.  However, I think in the end I'm ahead, because now they know my terms.  I'm charging (a meager..but at least something) $75 per night for a local show.  Longer distances or larger venues will require more compensation.

Overall, I think it turned out well.

I wouldn't be too polite with your band mate.
It sounds like they are seriously taking you for a ride.
I'd expect everyone to chip in (equally) with set up and breakdown. They're all using the PA right?
Asking for extra money might be tricky, but they should help equally with the hard work and make some contribution to the maintenance of the rig.

Hello,

I played for ten years in a local cover band circuit.

The band leaders all owned the PA's and would "charge" the band for the "rental" of said PA.

This is how it has always been done.

To me this is purely common sense.

If the band members aren't happy, fire their asses and hire some pros.

You're ripping yourself off.

Best of luck,

Joe Jordan

If somebody does the business for the band, he or she should get paid more. If somebody provides and schleps the PA for the band, he or she should get paid more. That's just show biz. Music is NOT necessarily a democracy! Do extra work, make extra money.

You should get paid extra, period. Even if they help schlep the gear in and out. You are the one who has to replace the speakers when they blow, not them. Our guitar player bought the PA and we pay a flat $150 per night on top of what we all get paid. To rent a PA of equal power and specs it would be AT LEAST $300. We also have a road crew of 4 that sets most of the gear, Drums, guitar amps, speakers and it's totally worth it to me. I don't have to carry the PA, or maintain it, and I've got a guy who helps me carry my gear in, set it up, tear it down and load it out. I still get out with about $120 per night after all the overhead. Carrying a PA sucks, period. If they don't want to pony up the dough tell them to find someone else or to rent a PA every night. Having your own sound is a plus because ou know what you're going to get every night. No surpises with an underpowered system or crappy gear.