New York Frank
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« on: April 30, 2008, 08:24 AM » |
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Ok, this isn't for nationally known or world known touring pros. And, it isn't for the weekend warrior making a little extra cash. I'm talking about - those of you, without being well known and touring with the greats, who are 100% making your living with drumming. Tell us - specifically what are you doing? Some answers I would expect: - Playing on a cruise line - Playing in a frequently working, well paid wedding band Please tell. 
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The secret to my tone is - always plenty of fresh Fruit Of The Loom underwear on hand
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boomka
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« Reply #1 on: April 30, 2008, 08:55 AM » |
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I did ships for a long time. Now I'm teaching, playing some one-off gigs here and there and looking for the right function band. But, today, I got offered a short stint on a ship and I'm ever so tempted. But, as I said in the thread I started about it, it means possibly risking my reputation depending on how my teaching employer reacts.
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In lumine lucem
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riot2003
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« Reply #2 on: April 30, 2008, 08:58 AM » |
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I can't wait for the day that it is my 100%. It is for a few months out of the year while touring, but those months are usually really really skinny when it comes to how I live and the niceties that I enjoy.
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Patrick Danger Quigley doctor!doctor!-Midwest Indie/Experimental/Metal www.myspace.com/wedontmakehousecalls2000 DW Collectors (12, 14, 16, 22), Tama Artwood Maple Snare (limited 7x13 black), DW5's double, 22 paragon ride, 20 and 18 aax crash, 13 aa fusion hats, trashy 18 wuhan china.
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chilledbongo
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« Reply #3 on: April 30, 2008, 03:34 PM » |
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drums might possibly be the hardest mainstream instrument on which to earn a living. by mainstream, i'm not talking about the flute or the kazoo or the cello etc which are even harder to live off. that's because, i hate to say it, drums are just so inessential to music making on a basic level. now, don't jump all over me! i work with a number of solo musicians who manage to do it full time, though in local obscurity. it amazes me. they are all guitarists who sing. i play with them because it sounds great, but essential? far from it. keyboards, woodwinds, brass? can all be ft more easily than drums, imho 
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less is more
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TeReKeTe
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« Reply #4 on: May 01, 2008, 12:06 AM » |
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(note: i just read this back and realized it might sound a bit braggadocious. if it does, I certainly didn't mean it this way; I just wanted to answer the original post of how we make it work. It's more written with the general sense of freelance-musician paranoia: the "oh my god, i'll never work again!" feeling.)
gotta side w/ chilledbongo on this one. i make my living making music. i've been playing drums for about 23 years. i barely make my living playing drums.
what i do: some broadway (less in the past years as the big shows have stayed on and there's less opportunity to get new seats/new subbing gigs), though i had great run for a few years. even then, wasn't playing drums-- was playing percussion.
The great thing about broadway is that it's the shining star of the legit, contractor-driven scene. I've gotten a healthy amount of great gigs simply through the network of contractors who work with so-and-so, etc. I'm doing a tour in mexico in a month with a well-known artist-- it's a gig i wouldn't have gotten without having had some connection (ie, years of playing for next-to-nothing while holding down a day job until an opportunity came along) to that.
lots of on-and-off teaching, but it's extremely hard to find dedicated and consistent students. I'd like to teach at the college level but (and this is bad planning on my part) i don't have an MA. that could change, of course, and if i taught i'd like to be a balance of ethnomusicology/post-diasporic subcultural theory/music. I've done guest lectures on that, but not easy to nail a full-time position doing that.
I play an extremely healthy amount of indian weddings--sometimes 3 to 5 in a weekend. I play dhol and tabla and not only are these fun gigs-- they pay extremely well. Last saturday morning i was playing dhol on a yacht to 200 people dancing (after getting home from a gig in baltimore at 4am). If you gotta grind it out, there's worse ways to do so.
a fair bit of session work--i'm on the last records by Jennifer Lopez and Taylor Dayne--but again there's less and less that goes on in NYC and, seriously, you've got cats like Sean Pelton here who've been doing it for ages as your immediate competition. Session work isn't as glamorous as i think i thought it was when i was growing up; it's also not the label-and-union driven thing that it was even 5 or 7 years ago. What it is, mostly, is doing work on spec for a producer you know and trust and then, once they get a tune signed, getting a check in the mail 2 years later.
or, in the case of certain producers, not getting a check and having to call and berate their imbecile junior staff/interns into sending the @$%# check after you heard the song on the radio.
I also have a solid, dependable, well-stocked recording setup here, and have done a good bit of remote recording, ie-- getting files from someone, laying drums or perc on the session, and ftping it all back. I've done a good bit of video game scoring work this way, as well as on-spec collaborations with some composers. definitely a good process, and one that i'm sure we'll be seeing more of. I know Billy Ward does a bunch of this.
really it's all about diversifying. I can't imagine making a living only playing drumset and i don't know any drummers who do-- the peers of mine that are making this work all teach, play other percussion gigs, grind out wedding gigs, do contracting, etc.
I run a monthly DJ night as well at one of the better clubs in town and that's become a really great focal point for getting done what i want to get done both musically and professionally.
In this day and age, on the circuits that i run in, performing music is a craft and writing it is in art. The craft pays consistently, but not phenomenally. If you can make the art work for you-- writing for a commercial, doing remixes, landing sync licenses for TV shows, doing dance arrangements on b'way licensing stuff for video games-- you'll be making $ that follows a back-end, residual model. For everyone i know who's really making a NICE living playing music, regardless of instrument, that's what's paying the bills, funding the roth IRA's, and (in one case) buying the vacation house in connecticut.
Drumming is great but unless you're in a good band that's got great business behind them, playing tons of well-attended shows, and getting a cut of the publishing $ on the tunes-- the world has changed. Very very VERY few hired-gun gigs pay enough to eat off of, let alone pay the rent.
so, in a word? HUSTLE. figure out what you're good at, what separates you from the pack, and do that. that's the way to make it work.
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New York Frank
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« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2008, 08:20 AM » |
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Wow - outstanding, fascinating post. Thank you.
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The secret to my tone is - always plenty of fresh Fruit Of The Loom underwear on hand
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felix
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first class all the way :-)
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« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2008, 08:27 AM » |
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Thinking about going pro Frank?
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Sonor, The Drummers Drum
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New York Frank
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« Reply #7 on: May 01, 2008, 09:06 AM » |
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Thinking about going pro Frank?
No - just very interested in the topic. I love music, and I love playing, but I fully know I will Never come close to having the goods. To tell you the truth, about the only thing I'm thinking of is - surrendering. I was getting close to having a friend evaluate me for a jazz gig, so I logged hours on the recorder last night, and it - hurt real bad. Really, really bad. I suck, and I'm not so sure it's going to change.
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The secret to my tone is - always plenty of fresh Fruit Of The Loom underwear on hand
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Drum4JC
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« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2008, 11:46 PM » |
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TeReKeTe - Aside from Mr. Whitten's posts, that is the most informative post on making a living in the music biz that I've seen.
Frank - Aw c'mon man! Don't sell yourself short. Granted, we're not all capable of playing like our heros, but the fact that you love to play means you have something to offer. It's just a matter of finding the right outlet. I'm fortunate to have TWO outlets that are absolutely perfect for me. I'll never be a pro, or even a widely respected drummer, but I'm OK with that. I have sticks in my hand at least three times a week and I have a blast doing it.
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Coming in 2008: The Delta-3 Snare Drum by Fusion Drums. www.fusiondrums.com. Look for updates here at the Drummer Cafe!
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Chris Whitten
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« Reply #9 on: May 02, 2008, 02:35 AM » |
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i make my living making music. i've been playing drums for about 23 years. i barely make my living playing drums. Just chiming in to back this up. I know people at all levels of the music biz. The key word that's emerged over the last 15 years has been diversification. I would think the only drummers who make a living solely from performing on their drums, are the guys in successful bands; U2, Coldplay, Chili Peppers, etc.... Everyone else is doing clinics, teaching, composition, programming, producing etc. In the early 90's I made a living solely from drumming. Then I mostly wrote music for tv with a bit of drumming on the side. Then I worked on drum sample products, as well as wrote for television and a few sessions. Now I do very few sessions, about one short tour a year, hoping to keep doing the drum sample products, hoping to develop my own 'remote' recording facility, AND grow grapes (farming basically).
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felix
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first class all the way :-)
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« Reply #10 on: May 02, 2008, 05:27 AM » |
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No - just very interested in the topic.
I love music, and I love playing, but I fully know I will Never come close to having the goods.
To tell you the truth, about the only thing I'm thinking of is - surrendering. I was getting close to having a friend evaluate me for a jazz gig, so I logged hours on the recorder last night, and it - hurt real bad. Really, really bad. I suck, and I'm not so sure it's going to change.
Easy now. Make sure you always play drums for the right reason. The money will come. You don't have to be driving a bentley or be on a world tour to be a success. And maybe you are setting the bar a bit high right now, which is ok too but can lead to depression. I would also read the Kenny Werner "Effortless Mastery" Book to get your head back together. Terekete and Chrisso made amazing points. You will have to hustle like any job right now to get more $$$ but then drumming is not always so much fun when one has to "meat" drum all the time. Personally I hated being a professional- semi pro is more my speed and a helluva lot more fun.
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Sonor, The Drummers Drum
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New York Frank
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« Reply #11 on: May 02, 2008, 07:54 AM » |
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Easy now. Make sure you always play drums for the right reason. The money will come. You don't have to be driving a bentley or be on a world tour to be a success. And maybe you are setting the bar a bit high right now, which is ok too but can lead to depression. I would also read the Kenny Werner "Effortless Mastery" Book to get your head back together.
Terekete and Chrisso made amazing points. You will have to hustle like any job right now to get more $$$ but then drumming is not always so much fun when one has to "meat" drum all the time. Personally I hated being a professional- semi pro is more my speed and a helluva lot more fun.
While I'm about to slightly derail the thread: My discouragement has nothing to do with money. Music is not about the money for me. It's about playing, growing, reaching a minimum level of ability, and performing. I'm starting to doubt if I can ever reach a minimum level of ability that is satisfying.
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The secret to my tone is - always plenty of fresh Fruit Of The Loom underwear on hand
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felix
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first class all the way :-)
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« Reply #12 on: May 02, 2008, 08:02 AM » |
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You gotta read that kenny werner book frank. Plus what doesn't make you quit makes you a better player. Hell, you can always devolve into a rock player like myself. My jazz playing is atrocious (well all jazz playing sounds like a bunch of mistakes to me). LOL JK!!! 
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Sonor, The Drummers Drum
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kohei
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« Reply #13 on: May 02, 2008, 11:34 AM » |
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Kenny's book has some wonderful points, but it does kind of gloss over that he was pretty much a child prodigy/wunderkind. My buddy Dan had a funny observation/comment, he said " according to {Kenny's book} the only reason I can't speak Japanese is because I'm not relaxed enough."
NYFRANK - playing in NY is a pretty ear opening experience, there's ALWAYS somebody around who's got something going on that we don't hear in our own playing. Add that to the folks that are around who are records you came up listening to (my first gig in the city, I'm stepping all over a dear and tender portion of my anatomy and I look up and sitting at the bar about 5 feet away from me are Keith Copeland and Ben Riley), and that can make playing a very difficult row to how, if what you are doing is holding your playing up to an external yardstick. All you can sound like is what you sound like. The only thing that changes the way you sound is steady, consistent focused work in the shed. Buy you have to reach some level of contentment with where you are. It has helped me to know that, no matter where I am right now, I'm doing work that's getting me deeper. I have goals I've set for myself, I work towards those goals. I communicate with other musicians to the depth that I can currently, because communication is important to me. If there are other musicians that can carry the conversation to a deeper level than I currently can, that doesn't really say anything about me, right? I still can only communicate to the level I can. Plus, it's not like yer taking somebody's brain out, right?
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If thine enemy offend thee, give his child a drum.
"It takes pretty great drummer to be better than no drummer at all." - Chet Baker
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New York Frank
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« Reply #14 on: May 02, 2008, 12:11 PM » |
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... but it does kind of gloss over that he was pretty much a child prodigy/wunderkind.
Makes it hard for me to go look at what he has to say if he was born a prodigy. My buddy Dan had a funny observation/comment, he said " according to {Kenny's book} the only reason I can't speak Japanese is because I'm not relaxed enough."
That's funny stuff. Definitely hits home.
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The secret to my tone is - always plenty of fresh Fruit Of The Loom underwear on hand
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felix
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first class all the way :-)
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« Reply #15 on: May 02, 2008, 12:26 PM » |
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Kohei mistook my point and some of Kenny's. I didn't know he was a prodigy and the book helped me. I'm the farthest thing from a child prodigy.
I especially liked the parts of the book where he encourages one to be themselves and not to get down on one's playing.
But I was just offering some help. You will have to make up your own mind about the book if you do decide to read it. No big deal, just trying to help.
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Sonor, The Drummers Drum
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felix
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first class all the way :-)
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« Reply #16 on: May 02, 2008, 12:28 PM » |
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Yeah, and I didn't mean to imply you played stiff Frank and you needed to relax. Like I said, those weren't the intended points.
There are critics for every book out there.
But yeah, you had a bad rehearsal. It happens.
Really tho' how long have you been at the skins? Give yourself a break. It takes a decade of playing a style religiously I think to just be a mere mortal. I'm pushing 30 years of playing rock. I listened to some recordings from rehearsal this week. C'mon! There were a couple of cool bars but I'm just another guy who plays drums.
Look for those little nuggets and work on the stuff that isn't so rosie smelling.
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Sonor, The Drummers Drum
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New York Frank
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« Reply #17 on: May 02, 2008, 12:32 PM » |
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Yeah, and I didn't mean to imply you played stiff Frank and you needed to relax. Like I said, those weren't the intended points.
There are critics for every book out there.
Felix - I know you didn't imply anything. You're trying to help, and the book suggestion is great. I have heard about that book a million times in my life.
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The secret to my tone is - always plenty of fresh Fruit Of The Loom underwear on hand
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felix
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first class all the way :-)
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« Reply #18 on: May 02, 2008, 12:35 PM » |
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yeah, it's totally a jazzer's book. You will love it I think. Some of the meditation stuff is a little wacky doodle, but it's fun to fool around with once and awhile.
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Sonor, The Drummers Drum
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riot2003
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« Reply #19 on: May 02, 2008, 01:06 PM » |
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anyone in the midwest might let a young drummer borrow this book? Sounds like an interesting and possibly inspirational read.
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Patrick Danger Quigley doctor!doctor!-Midwest Indie/Experimental/Metal www.myspace.com/wedontmakehousecalls2000 DW Collectors (12, 14, 16, 22), Tama Artwood Maple Snare (limited 7x13 black), DW5's double, 22 paragon ride, 20 and 18 aax crash, 13 aa fusion hats, trashy 18 wuhan china.
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