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Author Topic: Paila/timbale question  (Read 1023 times)
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TMe
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« on: February 12, 2003, 02:22 PM »

I've been studying Salsa music for a while, but I've decided against adding timbales to my drum kit.

Can anyone suggest a percussion instrument that would simulate the sound of tapping the side of the timbale when I'm playing paila patterns?

The closed high-hat works, but I'm hoping to find something that sounds more like a timbale and less like a cymbal.  The sides of the floor tom sounds like garbage and the side of the snare is too crowded with hardware.

Right now I'm using an electronic pad, but I'd much rather have something acoustic.

Ideally, I'd like something small in size and not terribly expensive.  

Any suggestions?
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lavic
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« Reply #1 on: February 21, 2003, 09:38 AM »

A Timbale.
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« Reply #2 on: February 21, 2003, 12:53 PM »

Thanks, Lavic, that's very helpful.

Actually, one possiblity I've read about is an instrument called a "gua gua".

Another is a an x-hat with tiny, very dry cymbals.
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« Reply #3 on: February 21, 2003, 01:08 PM »

You might check out Yamaha's Cascara Wedge, shown HERE.

But it's wood, not metal.

You might also try either a small piece of sheet metal, or maybe even buy a super cheap metal snare at a garage sale, and cut out a section of its shell and mount it somewhere on your kit.
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« Reply #4 on: February 21, 2003, 01:24 PM »

I'm surprised to hear that you think the side of the floor tom sounds bad. That's actually a traditional way of approaching the Paila patterns when on a drumset (c. 1940's).

For those not familar with this term:

Paila - pronounced PAEE-lah, simply means to play on the shells; synomynous with Cascara. The word pailas originally came from a vessel of iron or copper used in the sugar cane factories of Cuba. Many Cuban timbaleros use the word Pailas to refer to the timbales, and Cascara to playing on the sides of the drum. Paila patterns (ie. verse) are used in softer sections when a cowbell is too much; playing on one or both shells of the timbales.

Here's a few more latino tricks.

Use the bell of a cymbal ... but ... with the following technique. Take your index finger, and put it on top of the stick ... like what you were taught NOT to do when first learning to hold the sticks. When playing on the bell with this technique, you play down into the cymbal, leaving the stick on the cymbal for a few milliseconds; basically not allowing to rebound. This digging in technique helps to mute the resonance of the cymbal and creates more of a traditional sound.

You can use this same technique when playing on the timbale, as well as on the floor tom. I also recommend that you ONLY use the tip ... which is the traditional way to approach this on the floor tom.

I've also used the bell of the hihats, but tend to like the sound I get when I use the shoulder of the stick, rather than the tip. The tip or shoulder of the stick are both valid; just use the one you like best ... or vary it.

You can also use the hihat stand, or cymbal stand. Play on that ... finding the stand and area of the stand that gives the most pleasing resonance and tone.

Try mixing bowls, or any other metallic cylinder.

It may be that you don't like the floor tom, because of the size of the drum and the type of heads you are using. If you have a 14x14 and/or single ply heads tuned with a "jazz" tuning (higher pitch), the resonance from the shell and the heads sound really nice.

Just remember, Paila is about the rhythm ... don't feel like it MUST be on a timbale ... because traditionally speaking, no one holds that kind of restrictions on the sound.
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« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2003, 03:09 PM »

i tend to use barts idea of the high hat bell when i want that kinda sound cause all my drums are wood.  with the hats closed, tight clang kinda sound.
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« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2003, 03:11 PM »

There's also the Richie Garcia Signature Cascara



Curved plate of raw bronze fits to tom or timbale for dry, metallic sticking effect in grooves, solos and claves.

It sounds cool.

You could probably make something yourself, however this is a hand hammered plate.
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« Reply #7 on: February 22, 2003, 08:54 AM »

i tend to use barts idea of the high hat bell when i want that kinda sound cause all my drums are wood.  with the hats closed, tight clang kinda sound.

I use the high hat bell too.  Don't want to beat on my drum finish.  On the wrapped kit, I whack away on the sides.
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« Reply #8 on: February 22, 2003, 09:32 AM »

I use the high hat bell too.  Don't want to beat on my drum finish.  On the wrapped kit, I whack away on the sides.

oh ill beat on my shells  Grin  but thats for wood tones ... then again, im probably less concerned about my contact paper wrapped whitehalls than i would be something fancy  Grin
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« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2003, 10:15 AM »

I typically play on the lugs or rim of the floor tom, not on the shell itself ... for just the reasons you mentioned. The only I play on the shell is at soft volumes which does little or no damage to the drum.

If it was a session, I would probably be more picky about the sound, but the lugs on the drum still gets some shell resonance. Besides, paila is traditionally a metalic sound, not wood. Doesn't mean you can't use wood, but it's worth mentioning that by not using wood ... it's not like you are breaking tradition ... if that is a hang up.
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« Reply #10 on: April 25, 2003, 05:59 AM »

Thanks for the info.  I've learned the "sticking" stick technique (pardon the pun) for the cowbell, but it never occurred to me to use it on the cybals.  It really does make a big difference. I'm unable to do it at really quick tempos, though.

The Richie Garcia Signature Cascara looks like just the ticket.  I should be able to make something similar.  
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