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dogxray
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« on: November 16, 2003, 08:03 AM » |
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I have been experimenting with my hihat sound. I cannot decide what sounds better the shaft of the stick hitting the edge or playing with the bead of the stick. I play rock/ alternative and of course depending on the mix is how I play them. But what technique is everybody using?
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Jon E
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« Reply #1 on: November 16, 2003, 09:18 AM » |
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Here's my answer in a nutshell:
Generally I think most HH playing is done with the shoulder of the stick on the edge of the HHs--at about a 45 degree angle. This allows the stck to ahve enough "oomph" the make the HHs react with each other--especially when slightly open.
Of course, the tip can used if that is the desired sound, but I think your type of music would call for that sound much less frequently.
Just my thoughts.
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563
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« Reply #2 on: November 16, 2003, 09:27 AM » |
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I tend to play with the bead on top (though near the edge). Gives me a more articulate sound and allows rolls and things. But if the song calls for it, Ill lay into 'em on the edge with the shoulder. Totally different sounds, its like asking if you play the ride or hats. Hopefully you do both depending on what you need.
If you want a bigger washier sound, but still want the articulation of playing on top, experiment with different hats. Big thin hats can get washy fast even when your playing on top with the bead. You just have to work the pedal right.
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Making bad art. Saying stupid things. Implimenting my master plan to be forgotten when I'm gone and forgettable while I'm here. The Luna MothmeTableland
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cavalier302
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« Reply #3 on: November 16, 2003, 10:15 AM » |
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I normally hit the top of the hi-hat with the bead of the stick rather than the side of the hi-hat with the shoulder for three reasons: I like the sounds more, I can do it easier and quicker(more rebound), and it extends stick life. That's not to say that I never play hitting the shoulder of the stick to the edge of the hi-hat, if that's the sound I want that's the way I'll play.
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Tony
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« Reply #4 on: November 16, 2003, 11:34 AM » |
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Playing the hi hat is a blend of both. Certain music sounds better with the bead on the top, some with the meaty part of the stick attacking the side. You shouldn't limit yourself to one exclusively.
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The techniques, though they play an important role in the early stage, should not be too restrictive, complex or mechanical. If we cling to them, we will become bound by their limitation. Any technique, however worthy and desirable, becomes a disease when the mind is obsessed with it.
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Bart Elliott
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« Reply #5 on: November 16, 2003, 01:43 PM » |
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Both. It all depends on the sound I want.
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Joe
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« Reply #6 on: November 16, 2003, 01:59 PM » |
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Ever try playing the bell of the hi-hat? It's a nice, clunky sound when closed†.
When played open, it's a nice punctuation in the middle of a phrase.
†It's used to great effect on Kid Charlemagne by Steely Dan; although it seems that Bernard Purdie intended to aim for the bow of the hat rather than the bell throughout the passage, it sounds great nonetheless. It's a really distinctive sound.
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I'm not a particularly slow player, yet I don't play fast. I play half-fast.
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MrDrums
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« Reply #7 on: November 16, 2003, 02:32 PM » |
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Both. It all depends on the sound I want.
Ditto! Nothing more, nothing less.
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random
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« Reply #8 on: November 16, 2003, 09:45 PM » |
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Ever try playing the bell of the hi-hat? It's a nice, clunky sound when closed†.
When played open, it's a nice punctuation in the middle of a phrase.
my FAVORITE way of playing it!
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Chris Whitten
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« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2003, 01:46 AM » |
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I'd tend to go with JonE's answer, given that you are mostly playing Alt. Rock. Bartman gives good advice as do all the other replies. I can't say I've bounced my sticks on Hi-Hat too often though. As everyone say's, experiment with all techniques. I probably subconciously use the stick tip in quieter sections of music and the shaft (at 45 degree angle) in louder sections.
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drwalker
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« Reply #10 on: November 17, 2003, 08:35 AM » |
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Hi-Hat technique has been my personal obsession. This is the part of the drum kit that I think enhances the music (for me) therefore I have been relentless in trying to learn as many techniques for playing the Hi-Hat. I believe the two best hat players are Dave Weckl and Jeff Porcaro to me they can play the hats in a way that just works with the music and gives it that extra spice. Therefore, for me multiple ways of playing the hats is the way to go and there isnt a perfect way just the best way for the music you are playing..
dw
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BBJones
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« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2003, 11:54 AM » |
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All the above. I also have my top hat VERY loose where I can push on my hats (at a 45 degree angle) and have my hats move to about a 45 degree angle the opposite way (that make sense?  ). This allows for extremely washy to extremely tight sound. .I think you can get more sound ranges from a loose top hat as well as all the clean and tight sound you need using the tip of the stick or closed hats (as opposed to a tightly clamped top hat). So for me: - 45 degree stick-open hats, super washy sound - 45 degree stick-closed hats, heavy but articulated sound - tip of stick-open hats, loose but articulate tiny ride sound - tip of stick-closed hats, super tight articulate sound - then everything in between all the above for variations including the bell (and under the hats, from the bottom up) and the stand, foot stomp etc...
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Chris Whitten
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« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2003, 02:22 PM » |
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I believe the two best hat players are Dave Weckl and Jeff Porcaro Well I certainly agree on Porcaro. You're probably right about Weckl too, but I'm not a big fan so haven't listened to him that much.
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ARCHxANGEL
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« Reply #13 on: November 18, 2003, 12:30 AM » |
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When playing my hats it really depends on the song and all.Some things call for the light tapping near the edge of the hats with the tip of the stick to get a cool groove fell while other times for a cool effect I will hit the hats while opening them all the way across from egdge to edge with pretty much my entire stick,Its a sweet sound for harder edged songs.It all depends,thay are so many ways to play the hats.Its all prefrence and style.I don't get into proper angles I just go with what feels right.If it feels right and natural and you don't feel like you are trying to do it then its most likely the best way to go.The body knows best.
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hippie
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« Reply #14 on: November 18, 2003, 03:53 AM » |
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I love laying into the quarter note with the shaft of the stick and playing the &'s with the tip on the top(or the other way around  ). But like someone else said, I try to play a hi hat pattern that fits the song.
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JeepnDrummer
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« Reply #15 on: November 18, 2003, 11:47 PM » |
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But what technique is everybody using?
Both. Sometimes separately, sometimes mixed.
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RHSquonk
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« Reply #16 on: November 19, 2003, 11:48 AM » |
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Whatever the song calls for. The songs structure and feel will dictate how it should be played.
example: "Fool in the Rain" by Zep. Play it both ways and see what a diffrence it makes in the way the song sounds.
My $0.02
-RHS
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mouse
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« Reply #17 on: November 19, 2003, 10:17 PM » |
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I like the shoulder on the side with slightly open hats sound but it doesn't fit all music. To help with groove i play tip on top and accent with the shoulder on the side. i.e 4/4 shoulder, tip, tip, tip, shoulder, tip, tip, tip. Gee that reads silly.
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Tama Granstar
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Mateus
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« Reply #18 on: November 21, 2003, 12:56 PM » |
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Both
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Chris
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« Reply #19 on: November 21, 2003, 06:53 PM » |
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i think you answered the question yourself!
but i use both, depending on situation and context.
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smoggrocks
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« Reply #20 on: March 08, 2004, 08:00 AM » |
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oof. i forgot the question already.  i use all parts, and sometimes turn the stick around and hit with the butt. i really like that sound. thick and monstrous. for certain tunes, i alternate between the bead and the shaft, using a 'rocking' wrist motion, or as my old teach used to call them, 'rockin' 16ths'. it sounds really cool, especially against a full electric guitar with a little flanger added it. this is the nice thing about drums. you can pretty much do what you want to do and play how you want to play [within reason], so long as it sounds good. but a funny note on this: we were watching some old video of us, and i saw that i used to keep my right crash cymbal way the heck off to my right side, like almost at 4:00. i suppose at the time i had a rational reason for doing it, but it made absolutely no sense ergonomically, AND you couldn't hear the cymbal worth a dang. but i guess that's why they say ignorance is bliss. 
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dizz
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« Reply #21 on: March 08, 2004, 12:07 PM » |
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You can also use the shoulder of the stick on the top for an overdrive hat sound lol
Hippie I use that technique/style alot (downbeats=shoulder edge / upbeats=bead top)
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psycht
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« Reply #22 on: March 08, 2004, 12:16 PM » |
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Allover. Tip, shoulder, shaft, bell, bow, underneath, etc...
depends on what sound I want.
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mudlark
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« Reply #23 on: March 08, 2004, 01:18 PM » |
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Allover. Tip, shoulder, shaft, bell, bow, underneath, etc...
depends on what sound I want.
There ya' go.
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felix
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« Reply #24 on: March 08, 2004, 02:02 PM » |
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The way that sounds the best. When I'm playing eighth notes or just about everything I have a pretty bad habit of using the moeller technique on quite a bit of what I play (so they sound more like quarters). On the really "straight" feeling stuff I'll keep my playing technique consistent (bead or shoulder) but usually every second note I'm playing with the one hand is not as heavy as an accent. I CAN accent the 2nd note with the proverbial "forearm throw-finger pull techniques" but if I'm just cruising, playing a run of the mill ride pattern, the first note of my ride patterns are a little more pronounced than the second. No biggie, I just learned that it can make your groove "feel" better using this technique. YMMV
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smoggrocks
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« Reply #25 on: March 08, 2004, 02:09 PM » |
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Allover. Tip, shoulder, shaft, bell, bow, underneath, etc...
depends on what sound I want.
There ya' go.
hey is it just me, or does that sound a little kinky? 
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psycht
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« Reply #26 on: March 09, 2004, 09:14 AM » |
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hey is it just me, or does that sound a little kinky?  I'm not one to bragg but.... 
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jokerjkny
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« Reply #27 on: March 10, 2004, 12:01 AM » |
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as this thread showed, there's a huge variety of ways.
but lately, i've been relying on the "shank o' the stick" hihat sound. love that fat hihat sound for a laid back easy groove.
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Terry
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« Reply #28 on: March 14, 2004, 07:17 AM » |
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Mostly the tip of the stick about an inch from the edge of the HH. I do, how ever, use the butt end to ride the edge depending on what I'm playing. Some rock calls for a louder, stronger sound and you use what ever it takes to deliver the goods.
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older, but still make music my way.
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bilkay
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« Reply #29 on: March 14, 2004, 04:02 PM » |
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What a great topic and great responses. I use the bead, shaft and butt of the stick and strike different areas of the hats, depending on the sound I want. As with all the different sound-sources in an acoustic kit, there is a huge range of sounds you can produce with the hihats.
Stewart Copeland made some beautiful noise on the hats with the Police.
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rocksurvivor
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« Reply #30 on: March 15, 2004, 04:31 AM » |
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Both with every combination in between, also between the hats sometimes.
now that is a new one for me, i gotta try that
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dizz
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« Reply #31 on: March 16, 2004, 09:50 PM » |
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Steve Smith does some amazing hi hat solos on his new DVD. Much of it was learned from the ooooooooold timers. Great stuff
He plays the top cymbal the bottom cymbal, shaft shoulder bead butt........ plays the hihat stand too rofl. uses one hand to aid in closing the hats as well as mute the cymbals, while playing the bottom hat with that same hand using traditional grip. I have been playing for about 20 years and never saw anything like that. Not that 20 years is a particularly long time, but it was the largest range of sounds I ever heard from one hihat. Worth a peek if want to see some of the potential of the hats. He also shares some of his tricks by explaining and playing slowly.
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