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LOUNGE => General Board => Topic started by: Thorne on August 16, 2004, 08:03 AM

Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Thorne on August 16, 2004, 08:03 AM
I stumbled across this the other day . and i thought it should be hosted for everybody to see.

 http://home.comcast.net/~nthorne/Pictures/Drum_Solo_-_Keith_Moon_Video.mpg]http://home.comcast.net/~nthorne/Pictures/Drum_Solo_-_Keith_Moon_Video.mpg

I think Keith was blasted when doing this solo.  

Any opinions ..?

I think his playing was so sloppy at times..He reminds me of some drunk at a show that just wants to have a laugh on the drums..
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Stewart Manley on August 16, 2004, 08:17 AM
I have to confess, I never ever "got" Keith Moon's drumming.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Paul DAngelo on August 16, 2004, 09:08 AM
I can go two ways on this.

Keith Moon was an absolute inspiration for me when The Who first hit the scene.  His drums on "Pictures of Lilly", "Happy Jack", and a number of other songs that pre-dated "Tommy" were like nothing else in pop music at the time.  He was also only like 19 or 20 and I was about 14 or so.

His drumming on "Tommy" and "Quadrophenia" was pretty darn good as well.

Seeing him "live" was another story.  I saw him one night on "In Concert" (for those of you that remember that show) and he did a terrible, sloppy drum solo.  It was my first introduction into his weaknesses.

I've also seen him live a number of times and at least once, he was pretty obviously drunk or something like it, because of his actions and his sloppiness when playing.

He had demons like a lot of people have.  You have to look at his positive contributions, I know he inspired a lot of kids my age at the time to either begin playing drums or playing with more "spirit".
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: percussionmonkey1 on August 16, 2004, 09:22 AM
I'm not a big keith moon fan  he did blow up his drums, and really trash his gear.
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: Paul DAngelo on August 16, 2004, 09:38 AM
I'm not a big keith moon fan at all, he blew up his drums, trashed his gear, and had no respect for his craft.  :-\
He hit the BIG TIME while he was still a teenager.  Everyone is so critical of everything that somebody has done.  I'd be interested to see the percentage of persons having "problems" when they are VERY young, given enormous amounts of money, can freely travel the globe and basically do what they want.

His trashing of his equipment went along with The Who's persona, which was created by Pete Townshend, not Moon.

It's really too bad when somebody actually has a weakness, I assume everyone being critical of Moon would have handled the situation much better and would not have succumbed to any weaknesses possibly inherent in their personality.

Remember, don't let your weaknesses be known or you'll be in for a good trashing.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Stewart Manley on August 16, 2004, 10:09 AM
I can go two ways on this.

This about covers it, I think. I only really got exposed to his later stuff, which simply didn't strike any chords in me. I'll take some time and hunt out some earlier material.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: sptucker on August 16, 2004, 10:15 AM
Moon might have been sloppy at times in live performances, and he was certainly not a technician, but he did have some impact on our art form (ok, maybe not jazz  :-\)  For that he deserves some credit.  

It's unfortunate that his inner demons and excesses destroyed him in public.  I think this video is a good example of that.  I, personally, think this solo sucks, but I'm sure he was bombed out of his mind, as someone else noted.  In contrast, listen to Live at Leeds for some good live Moon drumming.  

There are numerous flashes of brilliance (soberness?) caught on tape throughout his career, but this is definitely not one of them...
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: Joe on August 16, 2004, 10:16 AM
I remember seeing on black-and-white film a performance of "Can't Explain It", and I thought that Moon's playing was perfect—both technical and grooving.

The clip Thorne posted was a display not unlike that of some high-school kid at a usual house party, beating on a fishtank stand with "Hard Rock Cafe" (Phoenix) drumsticks off the bookshelf and cracking the fishtank while using it for a ride.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Thorne on August 16, 2004, 10:45 AM
I also found a video of Buddy rich and jerry lewis doing a drum off .

Only thing is . Its a 61 mb file and i only have room for 26 mb. Ill post as soon as i can find a host.

Oh i tried to compress it in RAR and it only compressed it  down to 51 mb :(
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Adam's Dad on August 16, 2004, 11:41 AM

...but he did have some impact on our art form...

Moon's playing was definately an early influence for me.  I remember playing along to "I Can See For Miles" and really digging his "soloistic" approach to his playing.  He never seemed to play a groove, but was always moving around the drumset playing 16th note patterns with forceful crescendos.  As a young player, I thought this was the way to go until I realized there was more to playing within a band than just banging out hot licks.

Adam's Dad
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: Vintage Ludwig on August 16, 2004, 12:13 PM
Moonie fought many demons by the midway point of his short lived career.  Townsend was really the destroyer of equipment-and moon was young and followed Townsend, and eventually went way beyond Townsend.  Early on, Moon was a good drummer.  I liked his style of play.  To me, I liked the way he used his drums to crash alot-INSTEAD of using his cymbals.  He was the first drummer I remember as using a bouble bass kit.  I mean he used them both-didnt just have an extra kick for looks!  By the time he reched the midway point, he was plastered-CONSTANTLY.  When he in the studio for a take, I understand he would rehearse maybe once, then roll tape and record.  Other times, he would show up hammered-tell everyone to piss-off, sit down at the kit and record.  He was a crapshoot when it came to his alcoholism.  He was much like his friend Bonham-you never knew which person you were going to see.  Moon played more often drunk than sober.  By the time the Whos last album came out,  his alcoholism was way beyond anybodys control.  And was causing dissention in the band.  But the Who Are You album contains some of his best drumming, at least in my humble opinion.  Lastly, if you look at the album cover (yes, I said album, not c.d.) he is sitting in a directors chair.  And on the back of the chair it reads "not to be taken away".   He checked out shortly after that albums release.  As far as the gold fish incident goes, I think its pretty cool.....CUZ HE USED A LUDWIG VISTALITE SET TO DO IT!!!!!!  I miss ya Moonie-
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: devtrirob on August 16, 2004, 03:59 PM
Moon just never did it for me,he's all over the place constantly,and that's just a great example of it! hell even Peter Criss's solo on alive 1 and 2 is more worthy then to have to see and hear the garbage he was doing there!
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: DoubleC on August 16, 2004, 09:52 PM
I caught a Who Concert yesterday.  I think after one of the songs I noticed he and his roadie were changing the right bass drum head during Townsend's  guitar solo.  It made me think if the guitar solo was planned or just "inserted" to change the bd head.  

The timing was pretty cool because as soon as the bd head was on, the guitar solo ended and they launched into the next song.  

In any case, his drumming didn't do anything for me.  I just couldn't get into his playing; he seemed all over the place and sometimes I just couldn't figure out where his 1 was at.  

dc
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: oxford on August 17, 2004, 01:17 AM
As Clint Eastwood said in a movie, "Every man needs to know his limitations"...Keith did not.
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: felix on August 17, 2004, 06:20 AM
I saw a couple of old who videos last night on VH1.

I miss ya too Moonie.  Who knows how great you would be today?

I love his drumming- so free, heck we only wish we could play that free and expressive while getting away with it.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Paul DAngelo on August 17, 2004, 06:42 AM
Gee Thorne, why didn't you just call this thread "Let's Bash Keith Moon"?  

What's the point?  An awful lot of seemingly hostile feelings for a guy that had a GREAT TIME playing drums.  Break out your "Tommy", "Live at Leeds", "Quadraphenia" and "Who's Next" CDs and play to them.  Wait, you probably haven't heard them.  See if you can match what he's playing.

Out of all of you that posted, how many actually ever saw Keith Moon LIVE?  How many of you saw the power, the passion, the energy, the spirit of his playing?

There IS a place for all of those qualities in playing, NOT just technique and knowing how to play a paradiddle in an appropriate section of a song.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Thorne on August 17, 2004, 07:26 AM
I cant say that ive seen the who live..  I know that i would love it. Keith moon had some great moments..

His flame just burned to hott and died to quick..

IF anybody wants to get into the WHO, pick up THE WHOS GREATEST HITS!

I still love to put the album on and crank it up.. One of the best...

Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Christopher on August 17, 2004, 07:29 AM
Moon was unorthodox, but that is part of what made his playing so exciting and original.

I echo Mud's sentiments,
Break out your "Tommy", "Live at Leeds", "Quadraphenia" and "Who's Next" CDs and play to them.

Incredible stuff.

Much of what he played was not easy and was extremely original. His drumming was a very large part of what defined the hugely popular "Who sound."  

I think we all owe a little to Keith Moon. He brought allot of attention to the drummer's throne.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Chris Whitten on August 17, 2004, 08:25 AM
Much of what he played was not easy and was extremely original. His drumming was a very large part of what defined the hugely popular "Who sound."  
I think we all owe a little to Keith Moon. He brought allot of attention to the drummer's throne.
Ditto, ditto, ditto.  :)
If you don't 'get' his playing that's fine.
It doesn't mean Keith Moon was no good. It means you don't 'get' his drumming.
I love the fact you don't know where 1 is sometimes. Neither Moon nor the other guys probably knew where it was either!
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Christopher on August 17, 2004, 08:55 AM
I love the fact you don't know where 1 is sometimes. Neither Moon nor the other guys probably knew where it was either!

Absolutely.

The phrase chaotic harmony comes to mind.



I have to go home and listen to "Whos Next" now…

Jonesin' some Who... Needs me a fix...  ;)
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Stewart Manley on August 17, 2004, 08:56 AM
If you don't 'get' his playing that's fine. It doesn't mean Keith Moon was no good. It means you don't 'get' his drumming.

I didn't claim anything else, nor did I take the opportunity to indulge in any other negative remarks. I chose the words I did because they most accurately reflect how I feel ... I just don't get it. This is likely to be at least as much my failing as anything else.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Mark Schlipper on August 17, 2004, 09:43 AM
Much of what he played was not easy and was extremely original. His drumming was a very large part of what defined the hugely popular "Who sound."  

I'll third this after the Chrises.

I think its obvious by the studio recordings that he was perfectly capable of keeping time and playing relatively neatly.   He had his own way of doing it, but it was done.

If you want to consider live recordings, think about how many videos/recordings there are vs shows they did.   Pretty small percentage.   Maybe they were the best, maybe the worst.   Hard to say since none of us saw them all.   So our perspective is skewed.

If nothing else I think a great testament to Moons drumming is the fact that noone else (cough*Purdie*cough) has jumped up to claim it.    They just can't.    ;D    
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: sptucker on August 17, 2004, 09:46 AM
Because of this thread, I broke out all my Who albums last night.  Yes, I said "albums"!  I played a song or two from each of them (OK, I listened to ALL of Who's Next, about half of Live at Leeds), and remembered why my first drum kit was made in England by Premier... because Moon inspired me when I was starting out.

If you haven't given them a listen lately, go back and queue up The Seeker, Run Run Run, Disquises, I Can See For Miles, Sparks, Amazing Journey, Bargain, The Real Me, I'm One, the list goes on and on.   There is some undeniably good drumming going on here.

He doesn't have Peart's precision or Bonham's feel.  He's just Moon, and he played his heart out...

 :'(
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: felix on August 17, 2004, 10:18 AM

He doesn't have Peart's precision or Bonham's feel.  He's just Moon, and he played his heart out...

 :'(

You said it man.  Makes me all gushy inside.  
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: Vintage Ludwig on August 17, 2004, 12:22 PM
Id be willing to bet that the majority of the people posting on this thread werent even born yet and therefore completely missed out during Moons heyday.  Do you realize he captivated a bunch of drummers in his day.  As sloppy as his playing may seem to people, I dare the average drummer to even try to come slightly close to duplicating his playing-he played his own style no doubt.  So if you never had the opportunity to see the Who live with Moonie, or you are unable to even try to play his stuff-ya shouldnt bash him, or any other drumming great.  Try something relatively simple like "my generation"....Id be willing to bet the avg. drummer would have difficulty with just duplicating his work on the ride cymbal alone.  Part of his style (being sloppy) was most definately purposeful.  Thats what music fans were into at the time.  He blew people away.  Mixed with the rest of the band, it was a great recipe at the time.  And they sold bunch of records-which is what ya wanna do, right? Hmmm....lets see, who were the biggest names in british rock in say 1965?  Hermans Hermits.....Beatles?  While Ringo was a good drummer, he was boring to watch.  Charlie Watts is a great drummer too....but along came Keith,  and the people said "oh my goodness"  get a load of this bloke!  Thats part of what made Moonie great-at the time he blew people away-theyd never seen ANYTHING like him!
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Chris Whitten on August 17, 2004, 12:29 PM
I think its obvious by the studio recordings that he was perfectly capable of keeping time and playing relatively neatly.   He had his own way of doing it, but it was done.
Some of those Who tracks like 'Who Are You' are very early examples of drumming in combination with keyboard sequencers.
Not only does Moon perform the task seamlessly, but he plays in his usual chaotic style and has the studio headphones gaffa'ed to his head. Ouch! that must have hurt.  :-X
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: Mister Acrolite on August 17, 2004, 12:33 PM
Thats part of what made Moonie great-at the time he blew people away-theyd never seen ANYTHING like him!

Agreed - Moon was TOTALLY unique among drummers. It's hard to imagine how his crazy, over-the-top drumming managed to form the basis of many hit records, most of which still sound pretty darn great.

Pat Travers turned me on to what a great drummer he was - he had tons of Who video footage that just blew my mind. This guy was over-the-top LONG before the Tommy Lee's, Myron Grombachers, and Morgan Roses of the world came along. Sort of like Gene Krupa mixed with the Tasmanian Devil!

Of the many famous drummers of the era, I find Moon's style is one of the hardest to imitate. Try playing songs like Won't Get Fooled Again in a live band, and try to stay true to his drum parts, while keeping a solid groove going - I've never pulled it off to my satisfaction!
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Vintage Ludwig on August 17, 2004, 12:54 PM
MAN.......SO TRUE!!!!! Remember the movie back to the future?  Theres a scene where whats his face takes the guitar and just starts shredding a nastee guitar solo.  As his solo comes to an end, he looks out into the crowd (like 1961 crowd) and the audience is dead silent w/ jaws dropped open.  He looks around and says wow-I guess you werent ready for that yet........THATS HOW IT WAS WHEN FOLKS FIRST SAW MOONIE PLAY-
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: Chris Whitten on August 17, 2004, 01:15 PM
Of the many famous drummers of the era, I find Moon's style is one of the hardest to imitate. Try playing songs like Won't Get Fooled Again in a live band, and try to stay true to his drum parts

Funny you should say that....
I was just reflecting on some recent live footage I saw of The Who with Zak Starkey on drums. Although he wasn't trying to copy Moon, I thought he encompassed the spirit of Moon's playing much better than most, certainly better than Simon Phillips IMHO.
Also, there is a Moon clone. His name is Chris Sharrock. He used to play with the Icicle Works (I think?), but has been holding down the Robbie Williams drum chair for quite a while.
I don't know if he would admit it, but I find him a very close, modern version of Moon, even down to the facial expressions. Check out 'Let Me Entertain You'.
I should say, Sharrock is a very gifted drummer in his own right.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: dougstiers on August 17, 2004, 01:49 PM
I also found a video of Buddy rich and jerry lewis doing a drum off .

Only thing is . Its a 61 mb file and i only have room for 26 mb. Ill post as soon as i can find a host.

Oh i tried to compress it in RAR and it only compressed it  down to 51 mb :(
Where is it located online?
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: BigBillInBoston on August 17, 2004, 01:56 PM
Funny you should say that....
I was just reflecting on some recent live footage I saw of The Who with Zak Starkey on drums. Although he wasn't trying to copy Moon, I thought he encompassed the spirit of Moon's playing much better than most.
I agree. I saw the WHO on TV a year or so ago with Zack on drums. He played very well and seemed to be playing in a Keith Moon kind of style with out imitating him.

BigBill
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: DoubleC on August 17, 2004, 04:33 PM
It's funny how my, "I don't get his drumming" or "I could never hear where his 1 is at" can turn into Moon bashing.

It's only my opinion and I'm sure there are other drummers who we admire where someone else will disagree.  

C'mon guys don't turn this into, "you don't admire him, what's wrong with you" kind of thing.  

dc

Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Bart Elliott on August 17, 2004, 04:52 PM
Those poor fish! The vibrations must just drive them crazy. So much for the "Don't Tap On The Glass" philosophy.

The footage I just saw makes me think of what I usually hear when I walk into the drum room at Guitar Center ... or any music store for that matter. (http://community.drummercafe.com/Images/emoticons/stunned.gif)
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: dizz on August 17, 2004, 05:18 PM
Was Moon the drummer for the song, Eminence Front (sp?) ?

That song has some serious attitude and Im not talking about lyrics.  Im thinking it may not have been Moon since the synthesizer was probably a later The Who.  Dont know much about the group really.  I was born in the early 70's and didn't seem as popular as other groups.  In my childhood, HBO had a The Who concert, but I think it was reunion or something -not sure

"Won't Get Fooled Again"  has been getting alot of airplay lately on some television commercial.  That song has a @$%#'d powerful intro.  Those guys played with aggression.  That was probably what carried them all as far as they went.  That powerful live exhibition

The video was pretty poor.  But it was edited too.  I would have liked to known how he got the point where the video started.  Hopefully that was a clip out of context.  

Im not dumping on Moon.  I really dont know the first thing about him and The Who.  I guess, like someone said above^, hes not a technician.  And if he was polluted for that clip (I couldnt really tell, other than his playing), that could certainly explain it.

Either way, thanks for the clip.  Never seen it before but have heard of the goldfish thing.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Vintage Ludwig on August 17, 2004, 06:40 PM
No, he was long gone by that time.  I dont recall who it was-nice groove though....
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: Christopher on August 17, 2004, 07:13 PM
Was Moon the drummer for the song, Eminence Front (sp?)

Nope.

That was  http://www.the-faces.com/kenney/kjb/kjbio.htm]Kenney Jones . He joined the band in October of 1978 and stayed until '82.

I remember reading that Pete thought Kenney would be fine as Keith's replacement, but Roger had serious reservations. Pete didn't really give Keith the credit he deserved. Roger knew what big shoes Keith had left behind.

Not that Kenney isn't an excellent drummer in his own right. I love the stuff he played on. You Better You Bet, Don't Let Go the Coat, Another Tricky Day, Athena and Eminence Front for example. They are some of my favorite Who songs. Cool videos for those tunes as well.

Ahh, the early days of MTV. When the M actually stood for music. Now it stands for Moron.

But I digress…  ;)

Before his tenure with The Who, Kenney was in the band The Small Faces in the 1960's,  
then with The Faces (with Rod Stewart & Ron Wood) in the 1970's

In retrospect, Kenney was smart not to try to be Keith. He probably would have failed and looked dumb in the attempt. He came in as himself and was honest in his playing. If hindsight is indeed 20/20, Kenney had some pretty good eyes to start with.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Christopher on August 17, 2004, 08:17 PM
In related news...  ;)

Here's a recent picture (August 9th) from the Hollywood Bowl.

(http://mywebpages.comcast.net/chrisodonnell/who.jpg)

Zak certainly looks the part.

Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Scheming Demon on August 17, 2004, 11:11 PM
Although I was very young at the time I was alive when Keith Moon was in his hey day.  No drummer during that time played anything like him.  I think he invented the stereotype of drummers being considered maniacs and crazy.  Does Animal from The Muppets seem familiar.

I remember watching him (on tv) and thinking, he looks so uncoordinated he can't possibly be that good of drummer.  Then hearing what he was doing and going Holy Mackeral the guy smokes and he's putting on a show at the same time.

As we all know excessive alcohol and drums do not mix very well.  

Keith was also a huge inspiration for Neil Peart.  Without Keith before him, there would be no Peart now.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Stewart Manley on August 18, 2004, 02:36 AM
Without Keith before him, there would be no Peart now.

Frankly, I don't believe that for more than the length of time it takes to read the sentence. Without Moon, there would have been someone else to inspire Peart. When it's in you, it'll find a way out.
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: Paul DAngelo on August 18, 2004, 07:43 AM
It's funny how my, "I don't get his drumming" or "I could never hear where his 1 is at" can turn into Moon bashing.

It's only my opinion and I'm sure there are other drummers who we admire where someone else will disagree.  

C'mon guys don't turn this into, "you don't admire him, what's wrong with you" kind of thing.  

dc


I was the one that used the word "bash".  It was not because of anything you posted.  It was because of the way the thread started:

I stumbled across this the other day . and i thought it should be hosted for everybody to see.

I think Keith was blasted when doing this solo.  

Any opinions ..?

I think his playing was so sloppy at times..He reminds me of some drunk at a show that just wants to have a laugh on the drums..

I have to confess, I never ever "got" Keith Moon's drumming.

I'm not a big keith moon fan at all, he blew up his drums, trashed his gear, and had no respect for his craft.  :-\

Up until this point in time, it looks like a "let's bash Moon" thread to me.

Then, it took this turn.

This about covers it, I think. I only really got exposed to his later stuff, which simply didn't strike any chords in me. I'll take some time and hunt out some earlier material.

Then it went into an open discussion of his abilities.  

My bad.  

I seem to have over reacted.  I know Moon is no "technician", but that is not all that is necessary to be an influential player.  

Ask Bart, I've never over reacted before  ;)
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: Thorne on August 18, 2004, 10:34 AM
My comment was more directed towards the clip...  It was not directed towards Keith moon and his legacy..  Even if his Legacy is surrounded by empty bottles..


 :)
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: Paul DAngelo on August 18, 2004, 10:37 AM
My comment was more directed towards the clip...  It was not directed towards Keith moon and his legacy..  Even if his Legacy is surrounded by empty bottles..


 :)
Unfortunately, you are correct about his legacy.

Once again, my bad.  

No bad feelings intended, I hope none were taken.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Thorne on August 18, 2004, 10:49 AM
No  its my bad really.. I could have started the thread off without a Negitive comment .  And let the clip speak for its self..

He is, and will be. one of the greats.. and a prime example of what happens to wasted talent.   I often wonder what the music world would be like if Jimi and Lennon ,Jopplin , Cass, Moon  were still with us. Who did i forget?



Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Stewart Manley on August 18, 2004, 10:54 AM
I often wonder what the music world would be like if Jimi and Lennon ,Jopplin , Cass, Moon  were still with us. Who did i forget?

All too many, sadly. Porcaro. Bonham. Kossoff. The list is, alas, depressingly long.
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: Bart Elliott on August 18, 2004, 12:03 PM
My comment was more directed towards the clip...  It was not directed towards Keith Moon and his legacy..  Even if his Legacy is surrounded by empty bottles..

My comments were also directed towards the clip ... and ... the poor goldfish.
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: Paul DAngelo on August 18, 2004, 12:37 PM
My comments were also directed towards the clip ... and ... the poor goldfish.
Lucky Moonie didn't use a snake head.  It probably would have eaten thru his tom head and walked off of the stage!

(http://pdrums.com/snakehead.jpg)
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: percussionmonkey1 on August 18, 2004, 01:04 PM
He hit the BIG TIME while he was still a teenager.  Everyone is so critical of everything that somebody has done.  I'd be interested to see the percentage of persons having "problems" when they are VERY young, given enormous amounts of money, can freely travel the globe and basically do what they want.

His trashing of his equipment went along with The Who's persona, which was created by Pete Townshend, not Moon.

It's really too bad when somebody actually has a weakness, I assume everyone being critical of Moon would have handled the situation much better and would not have succumbed to any weaknesses possibly inherent in their personality.

Remember, don't let your weaknesses be known or you'll be in for a good trashing.



I  just don't think it's right, no matter how much talent you have it still is incredibly disrespectful to trash drums the way he did. And I'm sorry but that takes away alot of my respect for him. If a band is being known for trashing their instruments,  I don't think that shows any respect towards your craft
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: percussionmonkey1 on August 18, 2004, 01:06 PM
I'm not saying Keith Moon was a bad drummer because he was awesome. His drumming on Tommy was great!  but the whole blowing up drums thing doesn't appeal to me.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Christopher on August 18, 2004, 01:07 PM
Here's a tiny slice of video showing part of an alternate studio take of Who Are You.

If you look closely, you can see what chrisso described in an earlier post... "has the studio headphones gaffa'ed to his head."

 http://mywebpages.comcast.net/chrisodonnell/who.wmv]Who Are You .wmv

Ouch is right.
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: percussionmonkey1 on August 18, 2004, 01:14 PM
My comments were also directed towards the clip ... and ... the poor goldfish.


I know, I feel bad for the fish. The video of his solo wasn't the best playing I've seen him do. But I did really enjoy his earlier drumming.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: robeb on August 18, 2004, 05:40 PM
Quote
I  just don't think it's right, no matter how much talent you have it still is incredibly disrespectful to trash drums the way he did. And I'm sorry but that takes away alot of my respect for him. If a band is being known for trashing their instruments,  I don't think that shows any respect towards your craft

That was show biz, not dissin' drums.
 
I was fortunate enough as a young teen to work as an equipment roadie type for them one night. It was their 1st tour of the states, 1966 (7?), and they were on a tight budget. Believe me, the road mngr. was very aware of where each piece of busted gear was on the stage before the lights went down.

As soon as they left the stage, he and his guys would gather up all the broken hardware. It was part of his job to piece back together the gear for the next show. They carried quite a lot of 2nd hand replacement parts and an impressive toolbox.

At the end of "My Generation" Townsend had broken a Gibson 335. He held on to the neck, but the body went into the audience. I watched as the chaos ended and saw an audience member run up close to the stage and grab that guitar body off the floor. He started running toward the exit and road mngr. Bobby said "I'll be right back". He chased that guy through the crowd, followed him out the door and was back in about 2 minutes with the goods. What a job he had...

The story goes - Pete was in a rather pissy mood one night early on. They were doing a show in some crappy club and he decided to vent...while on stage. After he had taken out his frustrations on his gear, the crowd went wild. Tried it again at another show, same reaction. Sounds like a formula for at least some moderate success... got to pay the bills. These guys were struggling musicians, who can blame them?

My point is: I wouldn't dismiss these guys as no talent bums that had no respect for their craft. They recorded some of the best rock ever. Whatever your opinion of loonie moonie and crew, the music still stands strong.

Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: Tkitna on August 18, 2004, 07:24 PM
I agree. I saw the WHO on TV a year or so ago with Zack on drums. He played very well and seemed to be playing in a Keith Moon kind of style with out imitating him.

BigBill

He ought to, Keith taught him how to play. It wasnt his old man that bought him his first drumset either. It was Moonie.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: super_grover on August 18, 2004, 10:57 PM
I've heard a lot of people saying Keith is better than Bonham, but I don't know, I never really believed that and this kinda supports my idea. Bonham's Moby Dick solos were just so much cleaner and more interesting, and he was just an extremely great drummer.
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: felix on August 19, 2004, 06:29 AM
Most people don't get drummers as being artists and individual art being different and impressive in it's own right.

So when the average Joe says something like "Neil Peart is the greatest drummer that ever played" I just say "absolutely"... it's not worth the argument.
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: Paul DAngelo on August 19, 2004, 06:37 AM
Most people don't get drummers as being artists and individual art being different and impressive in it's own right.

So when the average Joe says something like "Neil Peart is the greatest drummer that ever played" I just say "absolutely"... it's not worth the argument.
Bravo!
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Steve Phelps (Shoeless) on August 19, 2004, 08:49 AM
Those poor fish! The vibrations must just drive them crazy. So much for the "Don't Tap On The Glass" philosophy.




Not if the were "Rumblefish"!
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Chris Whitten on August 19, 2004, 10:03 AM
I've heard a lot of people saying Keith is better than Bonham, but I don't know, I never really believed that and this kinda supports my idea. Bonham's Moby Dick solos were just so much cleaner and more interesting,
Apart from the fact they are both great in their own right, I just don't think drummers should be judged on their solos. What about the stuff they're playing 90% of the time?
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: sptucker on August 19, 2004, 10:19 AM
I've heard a lot of people saying Keith is better than Bonham, but I don't know, I never really believed that and this kinda supports my idea. Bonham's Moby Dick solos were just so much cleaner and more interesting, and he was just an extremely great drummer.

I like to think of it this way:
Keith Moon is a better drummer for the Who
John Bonham is a better drummer for Led Zepellin
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Vintage Ludwig on August 19, 2004, 11:29 AM
I like to think of it this way:
Keith Moon is a better drummer for the Who
John Bonham is a better drummer for Led Zepellin

were comparing apples to oranges here......truth be told that they were very good friends.  As it was, Moonie told Bonham that his band would go down like a lead balloon......and thats how Zep got their name-
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: sptucker on August 19, 2004, 12:47 PM
were comparing apples to oranges here......truth be told that they were very good friends.  As it was, Moonie told Bonham that his band would go down like a lead balloon......and thats how Zep got their name-

No disagreement on the apples to oranges, here!  My point was that they both sound great in the bands they played in.   Try imagining what either band would sound like if the drummer's were swapped!

I love the Led Zep name story, especially since they just went with it regardless of the implied failure connotation.  The way I heard it, though, Moon said Lead Zeppelin and they simply took out the A...

I guess they proved Moon wrong...
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Nubert Thump on August 21, 2004, 06:50 AM
were comparing apples to oranges here......truth be told that they were very good friends.  As it was, Moonie told Bonham that his band would go down like a lead balloon......and thats how Zep got their name-

Just to clear this up a little here is a quote from the book 'John Bonham--A Thunder of Drums' by Chris Welch and Goeff Nicholls.

It explains how after the Yarbirds broke up Jimmy Page had a manager(Peter Grant) a bass player (JP Jones) and a plan to form a powerful rock band. At that time the Who hadn't released Tommy yet and their future as a band was questionable. Here is the quote(pg 72):
Quote
When the Who got wind of the plan, Keith Moon said they would go down "like a lead balloon." John Entwistle added it would be "more like a lead Zeppelin."  When page was casting about for aname, he chose Entwistle's phrase. Peter Grant changed the spelling to "Led" to avoid any confusion about the pronunciation.

So in fact it was Entwistle who coined the name Led Zeppelin not Moon, though his 'lead balloon' was clearly the inspiration for Entwistle's comment. Page had not yet brought Plant or Bonham in the group yet.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: percussionmonkey1 on August 22, 2004, 08:13 PM
That was show biz, not dissin' drums.
 
I was fortunate enough as a young teen to work as an equipment roadie type for them one night. It was their 1st tour of the states, 1966 (7?), and they were on a tight budget. Believe me, the road mngr. was very aware of where each piece of busted gear was on the stage before the lights went down.

As soon as they left the stage, he and his guys would gather up all the broken hardware. It was part of his job to piece back together the gear for the next show. They carried quite a lot of 2nd hand replacement parts and an impressive toolbox.

At the end of "My Generation" Townsend had broken a Gibson 335. He held on to the neck, but the body went into the audience. I watched as the chaos ended and saw an audience member run up close to the stage and grab that guitar body off the floor. He started running toward the exit and road mngr. Bobby said "I'll be right back". He chased that guy through the crowd, followed him out the door and was back in about 2 minutes with the goods. What a job he had...

The story goes - Pete was in a rather pissy mood one night early on. They were doing a show in some crappy club and he decided to vent...while on stage. After he had taken out his frustrations on his gear, the crowd went wild. Tried it again at another show, same reaction. Sounds like a formula for at least some moderate success... got to pay the bills. These guys were struggling musicians, who can blame them?

My point is: I wouldn't dismiss these guys as no talent bums that had no respect for their craft. They recorded some of the best rock ever. Whatever your opinion of loonie moonie and crew, the music still stands strong.


 That is, How you put it "dissin." drums. No one in their right mind would go around destroying gear. And that seemed to be something Keith was quiet good at. Like I said before, some of his drumming was very good but some of it was really not. and blowing up your drumset doesn't exactly show very much skill. I'm just saying he could've been alot better if he hadn't gone around beating up his drums, and doing the crazy things he did.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Chris Whitten on August 23, 2004, 02:33 AM
blowing up your drumset doesn't exactly show very much skill.  

No, but I don't think you are taking into account what was going on in culture at the time.
Keith was undoubtedly an important drummer in the evolution of rock drumming.
He was also a rebel.
He wrote the book on the rock n roll lifestyle, a lifestyle I can't relate to but countless other musicians have copied.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: Gregg Rivers on August 23, 2004, 10:12 AM
I always thought Keith "over played" on most of the Who's music. So having said that, you should be able to tell I'm not a Keith Moon fan. I think that "solo" if you want to call it that would be yet another example of why I'm STILL not. That's what my "solos" sound like! Which is why I don't do solos! ;)
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: JDrummys on August 24, 2004, 02:20 PM
I can't think of any other drummer other than Moon who essentially soloed throughout the verses of songs and still made the songs sound good (in fact, it can be argued that's a big part of what MADE them sound good!)...It took a boring drummer like Kenny Jones to help me see the contrast and how Moon's playing made the songs more interesting.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: percussionmonkey1 on August 25, 2004, 11:35 AM
No, but I don't think you are taking into account what was going on in culture at the time.
Keith was undoubtedly an important drummer in the evolution of rock drumming.
He was also a rebel.
He wrote the book on the rock n roll lifestyle, a lifestyle I can't relate to but countless other musicians have copied.


good point I can understand what you're saying
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: Ian on August 25, 2004, 01:32 PM
I saw this in my local paper about a week ago. It may interest some of you:

http://charmed.slayuk.com/ian/keith-moon-snare.jpg
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: Thorne on August 25, 2004, 01:53 PM
Very interesting artical..   Who do i complain to about the crick in my neck that i got trying to read it..  

I wonder if the drums were worth anything. He said that he gave them away.. I wish there was more info about the drum..What was the brand?

Thankyou for sharing.
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: Ian on August 25, 2004, 02:12 PM
Yeh, sorry about the orientation. I don't have any software installed right now to fix that.

It says it's Gretsch, custom made for Keith. I wish they'd given more info (and photos) too, but this is only a small local paper which is renowned for not being very good. And I suppose most members of the public wouldn't be interested in any more detail.

Next time I go to my local drum shop I'll ask the manager if he knows anything else about it (he's the other guy in the photo).
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: marker on September 02, 2004, 05:12 PM
Marker (revealing his age) actually saw that on tv, the first time.

Yep, it was a lousy solo.  Keith was proabably blitzed.

Also, if you stop and look, you'll realize there are no real drum solos on Who records.  I think that what Keith was really good at was interacting with the Who.  For him, a solo would be pointless.
Title: Re:Keith Moon Video
Post by: JDrummys on September 05, 2004, 10:03 AM
You can tell he was ripped, just from the way he was slurring his words at the end...however, the crowd still went crrazy after that crappy solo- just goes to show- when you're famous, you can practically do anything and still be loved.
Title: Keith Moon Video
Post by: gr82bagn on September 12, 2004, 08:15 AM
I agree, Moon the Loon personified that era of Rock & Roll. His approach was emotional as well as technical and the fans felt that honesty. Keith was also an extremist and more often than not his extreme habits did not coincide with his extreme talent. None the less Moon is missed. :)