Under-appreciated Drummers

[DWdrmr]

I made a play along CD  a couple weeks ago..and I included "Classical Gas" by Mason Williams from around....hm..'67, or so. I love playing that song. I think I was 14 and had'nt started drumming yet. But, I remember how much I liked the song and the drummer. I would always turn it up as much as my dad would let me in his car..(are you deaf?? what part can't you hear?...."the drums, Dad"..)
Anywho.....I wonder who did that little gem? Joe Porcaro, maybe?
Whoever it is, he certainly is under appreciated..
Of course, I could do my own homework...

[Paul DAngelo]

I do believe that would be Jim Gordon.

[TheBeachBoy]

Heard a U2 tune on the way into work this morning. I never hear Larry Mullen Jr. ever mentioned in any drummer discussions. This guy has done nothing but anchor one of the greatest rock bands ever. I think he actually comes up with some really interesting grooves. When one thinks of U2, all the glory goes to Bono, and maybe a little to The Edge, those other two  guys get nuttin'...

I saw that Adam Clayton was on the cover of Bass Player magazine for either or January or February.

[80sDrummer]

I'm voting for Stanton Moore from Galactic.
He tends to show up in Modern Drummer a lot, but few people I talk to know about him.
Then again most people I run into are into hip-hop & pop music, & Galactic isn't real "mainstream".
-Mike

[dsnooc]

I always really liked Dennis Elliott's drumming with Foreigner. He always impressed me with his style. Very solid, very nice rock feel. Drove the band but didn't over play. Take a listen.

[DWdrmr]

I do believe that would be Jim Gordon.

I would have never guessed that...Jim Gordon played "Classical Gas" ??
Altho, the time period is ..right there, when he was doing studio work.

[eardrum]

I noticed he stops playing the cymbal on 2 &4..the snare hits..never did get that.

I've never been a big fan of Charlie's or of the Stones - I also remember as a kid hearing Buddy Rich laughing or dissing his playing on the Johnny Carson show.  But - Dave Weckl mentioned his playing at a clinic one time.  He was talking about feel and how the body motion will really produce the feel.  He also mentioned Ringo's signature swinging the stick while playing straight 1/8th notes on the hat.  He said that Charlie produced a definite feel with his lifting the 2 & 4.  Comming from Weckl, I'd take note.  I think that guys like Watts and Ringo had such a sensitivity to the feel of the groove that they could produce a unique foundation for the songs.  Ringo even said in an interview (paraphrasing) that he hates to do a fill in a shuffle because it's so easy to interrupt the motion you've created with the shuffle rythm.  How many drummers are that sensitive to the feel of the groove?  

[hankster]

i like charlie watts alot. someone mentioned freddie and the dreamers. i think the drummer for them was bernie dwyer. listen to the song "do the freddie". i always liked the drumming in it.

[Tony]

Jon Fishman of Phish.  This guy is amazing.

[sptucker]

Phil Leavitt of the band dada.   Under appreciated, and probably unheard of by most of us.   One of my all-time favorites, actually -- which may not be saying much as I have soooo many favorite drummers!    It's unfortunate that this extremely talented band, like so many others, has been under the radar for years while lots of no-talents have become rich and famous.   But I digress.

I've mentioned Matt Abst of Gov't Mule before.  Add him to the list, too!

[DougB]

You know, Dave, I have just never "gotten" that guy..I mean he obviously fits the band (I listened to alot of Stones in the '60s, but it was always some other kids house/album), but the first thing that turned me off about him(in the 60's) is when I noticed he stops playing the cymbal on 2 &4..the snare hits..never did get that.

Anyone see Charlie do that same thing during the super Bowl half time show?  It's a little unnerving to watch.

[Jon E]

How about Martin Chambers from the Pretenders?  

HE is definitely under appreciated in my book.



and Marky Ramone?

[KevinD]

Oh, I just thought of one:

Terry Chambers who played on most of XTC's albums late 70s-early 80s. Songs like "Making Plans for Nigel" "Generals and Majors" and "Jason & the Argonauts" were all very strong and innovative tracks.

He incorporated a lot of subtly intricate things into his playing, yet he was very powerful.

From what I read,  he left the band, moved to Australia and became a construction foreman.

[Tkitna]

I suppose i'll give my annual shout out to Phil Ehart from Kansas my favorite drummer). He might not be under appreciated, but you rarely hear his name mentioned.

[DougB]

I suppose i'll give my annual shout out to Phil Ehart from Kansas my favorite drummer). He might not be under appreciated, but you rarely hear his name mentioned.

I do love some of the songs he played on.

[phantompong]

I think its 100% about sound. I never heard of Dream Theater till I started reading drumming forums. I think there is a reason for that.

Yes, there is. Anyone wonder why JP is a guitar god, JM is a bass god, JR is a keyboard god and MP is a drumming god, but most non-musicians don't know about them, or haven't heard their music? Because their music, I daresay, is much more appreciated by musicians than by non-musicians. Progressive rock isn't exactly the most mainstream type of music.

That said, I think a lot of underrated drummers are in the position where they don't get to "show off" their chops. Let's say, for instance, that Ringo could rip like Portnoy. If he did that in the Beatles, the Beatles would have been quite ruined, and we might not ever have heard of the guy. So does Mike Portnoy get a bonus for both fitting the music and having great chops? Perhaps - but that doesn't take anything away from other drummers who underplay to fit the music, nor does it take away from the virtuosic players who do rip *because* it fits the music.

My under-appreciated drummer vote goes to... Rick Allen. I do think Def Leppard is an example of how five very simple parts can come together to create a great song. The earlier Def Leppard stuff is flashier, but I think it's the later work that's really impressive - and all so simple. Listen to All I Want Is Everything, or Hysteria, for example - individual parts are so easy to play, but come together perfectly.

[Tony]

Yes, there is. Anyone wonder why JP is a guitar god, JM is a bass god, JR is a keyboard god and MP is a drumming god, but most non-musicians don't know about them, or haven't heard their music? Because their music, I daresay, is much more appreciated by musicians than by non-musicians. Progressive rock isn't exactly the most mainstream type of music.

That said, I think a lot of underrated drummers are in the position where they don't get to "show off" their chops. Let's say, for instance, that Ringo could rip like Portnoy. If he did that in the Beatles, the Beatles would have been quite ruined, and we might not ever have heard of the guy. So does Mike Portnoy get a bonus for both fitting the music and having great chops? Perhaps - but that doesn't take anything away from other drummers who underplay to fit the music, nor does it take away from the virtuosic players who do rip *because* it fits the music.

The other part of the reason DT is not commercially succesful is because their music has no soul.  It's technically impressive, but all sounds the same.  If there was ever a formula band out there, it's Dream Theater.  

[phantompong]

The other part of the reason DT is not commercially succesful is because their music has no soul.  It's technically impressive, but all sounds the same.  If there was ever a formula band out there, it's Dream Theater.  

That, I have to agree to some extent. Actually, I dislike their studio recordings a fair bit, not just on the formulas, but also because it sounds quite dead. I wasn't too happy the first time I heard Dream Theater either. But live, I don't have many complaints. Then again, people buy records and *then* go to shows.

[phantompong]

Then again, people buy records and *then* go to shows.

After some thought I decided my experience would make an interesting case in point. Dream Theater played here not long ago, and despite having heard almost nothing of Dream Theater's work, I decided it wasn't something to pass up, being a musician, and so decided to go. I picked up Scenes From a Memory to get a feel for Dream Theater's material because I've developed this habit of buying an artist's most representative material and going from there and Portnoy considers SFaM their best work so far.

I wasn't very impressed at all - impressed with their musicianship, yes, but as Tony says, they sounded quite soulless, and I felt a lot of areas were substandard - lyrics, for instance - for something purported to be a masterpiece. However, their live performance raised them much higher in my estimation - I still think their lyrics could be better, somewhat, but their live sound has an edge that doesn't get through the studio recordings. I guess performing in the moment for a live audience lends that edge.

That said, I don't recommend putting the cart before the horse, especially if you don't think the band or the performer will ever become one of your major influences.

[/off-topic]

[lonearrngr]

I would have never guessed that...Jim Gordon played "Classical Gas" ??
Altho, the time period is ..right there, when he was doing studio work.

Jim Gordon was one of the best and busiest studio guys of the era ( before he got in trouble ) and was an idol of mine back when I was still playing .

Other great players of that era ( some no longer with us and some still playing ):

Jeff Porcaro ( Toto ),Al Jackson ( Stax /Volt ), Paul Humphrey, Ed Greene, Paul Leim, Ron Tutt, Rick Marotta,Jim Keltner, and of course ..Steve Gadd.

:o