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Oktava OH mics

Started by sidereal, February 01, 2002, 10:16 AM

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sidereal

Doing a recording session with the band next week and I want to upgrade my tinny AKG c1000 overheads with Oktava mk012s (or mc012s, depending on whom you ask). They're on sale (always seem to be) at Guitar Center for $149 each (so $298 pair).

I've heard other great feedback on these mics elsewhere, with drawbacks being inconsistency from mic to mic and some issues of fragility. Last thing I want to do is go into GC and ask to give each one a critical listening test. What a drag.

I also saw that you can buy a better version of the mic where you can replace the capsules (2 additionals included). Is this worth the extra cash to get the additional capsules? Is it necessary? If so, what for?

And if anyone knows better pricing than GC on these (I heard someone else mention $99 a pop for them, but I don't remember where)?

Oh, and Bart, how about a "Gear" section on this site, where we can talk about drum kits, sticks, heads, mics, studio gear, etc? I didn't know where to post this.

(Felix, no Radioshack comments please ;D)


Bart Elliott

QuoteOh, and Bart, how about a "Gear" section on this site, where we can talk about drum kits, sticks, heads, mics, studio gear, etc? I didn't know where to post this.

Ask and you shall receive!

James Walker

QuoteI've heard other great feedback on these mics elsewhere, with drawbacks being inconsistency from mic to mic and some issues of fragility. Last thing I want to do is go into GC and ask to give each one a critical listening test. What a drag.

Side,

I've not tried the Oktavas, but I'm going to plow right ahead and comment anyway!!  ;)

My comments are based on what I've read on the rec.audio.pro and alt.music.4-track newsgroups, so take them with however many grains of salt you wish, but...

My understanding is that the lack of quality control of the Oktavas GC keeps in stock is completely off the map - enough that it's really Russian Roulette (no pun intended) to simply buy a pair and hope for the best.  There's an online store (IIRC) called The Sound Room (don't know the URL offhand) which will go through scads of the Oktavas, matching pairs and discarding those mic's which aren't assembled well - basically, doing the quality control checks that are nonexistent at the Oktava factory.  Of course, they charge $X more for the mic's, to compensate for their time and expertise.

If you don't want to deal with testing mic's, I'd suggest tracking down a pair of the Marshall MXL603s microphones - Sam Ash usually has them (for around $99 each, I've heard - check Mars Music as well), and they're considered a very good "bang for the buck" microphone (even in the hallowed halls of the rec.audio.pro Usenet group, whose participants are famous for verbally lambasting "semi-pro" gear) - I've got a pair of the Marshalls, and while I haven't tried them as drum overheads (yet), I've used them to record vibes and marimba, and they're very good IMHO, especially considering the price.

If you're only going to need the mic's for this session, another option (forgive me for stating the obvious) is renting better-quality mic's just for the session.

As always, IMHO, FWIW, YMMV, etc....

sidereal

Thanks James...

I'll look into the Marshalls. But I admit I haven't heard of them before. The reason I was looking into the Oktavas is because on recording forums, they're singled out specifically as excellent drum overheads. Supposedly they give an especially nice "silky" character and depth to cymbals, without any harsh high end -- which is why they're supposed to be great for digital recording (my medium).

I'm wondering two things: 1. what exactly would be involved in testing a mic in a Guitar Center. 2. knowing GC's policy on returning mics, would there be any weight to me arguing that given the inconsistency of these mics, they should make an exception and allow me to return them if they're bad?

Thanks again for the feedback! :)

James Walker

QuoteThanks James...

I'll look into the Marshalls. But I admit I haven't heard of them before. The reason I was looking into the Oktavas is because on recording forums, they're singled out specifically as excellent drum overheads. Supposedly they give an especially nice "silky" character and depth to cymbals, without any harsh high end -- which is why they're supposed to be great for digital recording (my medium).

The Marshall 603s mic's are recommended as drum overheads as well.

Here's the page on the Marshall mic' site:

http://www.mxlmics.com/mxl603s.html

...and I did a quick Google "groups" search on the rec.audio.pro Usenet group archives- there's more there than you'll ever want to read about the 603s's.

http://groups.google.com/groups?as_q=marshall%20mxl%20603&as_ugroup=rec.audio.pro&num=30&hl=en

QuoteI'm wondering two things: 1. what exactly would be involved in testing a mic in a Guitar Center. 2. knowing GC's policy on returning mics, would there be any weight to me arguing that given the inconsistency of these mics, they should make an exception and allow me to return them if they're bad?

I've never tested a mic' at GC, but the challenge will be getting into a space where you're not going to be dealing with kids trying out guitars and drums as you listen for the subtle differences between mic's.  I'd call your local store and see if they have a space suitable for testing mic's - even if it's just a quiet room off to the side, with a Mackie board and good headphones.

(Personally, I'd go with the Marshalls...but a good pair of the Oktavas should do fine - IF you can get a good pair...)

sidereal

Wow, thanks James... some great info there. I'm now seriously considering them. :)

felix

The Oktavas make cymbals sound fake almost...really brittle.  My friend just sent me his cd that they did with Oktavas as the overheads.  Download some samples at:

http://www.pattonrocks.com

I would stay away from the Marshall's and go with Cad Equitek 100's  $200 beans and awesome

Do you want to by 3 sets fo overheads.  Cause that is what you are going to do...you already bought 1 pair that stink and you are about to buy another...you will get sick of those and then buy some more.

But knowing you, you will get the octavas and be unhappy





sidereal

Well, I went with the Marshalls. Thanks James! :) Got a session this weekend, so I'll let you all know how they work out.

$157 for the PAIR! :D


James Walker

Hope they work out for you, Side' - the good news is, even if they turn out not to be your "cup of tea" and you decide not to keep them, you should be able to get most, if not all, of your investment back by selling them on the alt.music.4-track newsgroup, or on eBay.


Rader_Ranch

QuoteWell, I went with the Marshalls. Thanks James! :) Got a session this weekend, so I'll let you all know how they work out.

$157 for the PAIR! :D

well, maybe you'll have better luck than me...i'm still waiting to get mine...ordered Jan.31st...

you know, there's some mods out there that you can do at home for as little as $40 that supposedly make some of these Beijing mics sound way better...gonna try it on one of the Marshall 2001's...when they decide to get here >:(

felix

And a heartfelt thanks to all you Marshall buyers from the depressed Conneaut, Ohio- looks like leftovers for dinner again.


sidereal

Not to mention all the starving sweatshop child laborers in China. I think my purchase gave some 12-year-old girl 2 cents worth of rice.  :-/

(Just a little guilt to go with my gear lust.)


felix

I know...it's a bad scene...gotta love big politics wanting to even everything out and get that New World Order implemented as soon as possible.

felix


sidereal

They worked pretty well. A marginal, but nevertheless positive, step up from the C1000s. We ran them through a high-end Millennia preamp into Pro Tools. I think I was expecting to be knocked out in a C414, KSM44 kind of way... which is unfair. But I'm glad I got them, and at the price, they're a steal.

Keep in mind I was using a much better preamp than last time, so I'm not sure how much is the mics and how much is the Millennia (not that the last pre I used was dog meat, though).

They definitely captured the cymbals much better. Nice definition, good tone, and good presence. I did some crash rolls with felt mallets a couple times and they sounded gorgeous! I was somewhat disapointed with how they captured the rest of the kit. Seemed a bit hollow. I was hoping for more warmth and roundness. I noticed the Marshalls have quite a rolloff in the lower frequencies, so this is probably why. Some EQ should help.

I'm mixing/editing/arranging the sessions right now, and the sound is bound to get better through tweaking. Maybe I'll try and post some examples on my website-in-progress soon. If so, I'll post here.

Thanks again James! :)

[please don't take this post as gospel on the Marshall mics. the room we used was less than stellar, and that can be a huge factor.]

Bart Elliott

Being that you felt the improve from the C1000 to the Marshalls was minimal .... what about the C3000? Ever tried or used it?

sidereal

I've never tried the C3000. It's interesting because I've heard everything from raves to yawns about that mic. I'd imagine for overheads, they would be a nice improvement over both the C1000s and the Marshalls. I think the yawns over the C3000 was as a vocal mic.

If I were to step up, and still stay somewhat within a decent budget, I'd go Rode NT3 or even AT 4033, which seem to be on sale every so often. But I'd also look into the C3000... the price is attractive, that's for sure.

Incidentally, although marginal, the step up from the C1000s to the Marshalls was worth it to me. Given that the Marshall costs quite a bit less, I'd highly recommend this mic for tight budgets.

Bart Elliott

Well, I'm in the market for some overhead mics. Something that I could use on the kit as well as on small hand percussion, wind chimes, etc.

I've got a couple of AKG 414B/ULS but would rather not be forced to use those as my overheads.

Thoughts?

James Walker

QuoteWell, I'm in the market for some overhead mics. Something that I could use on the kit as well as on small hand percussion, wind chimes, etc.

I've got a couple of AKG 414B/ULS but would rather not be forced to use those as my overheads.

Thoughts?

My $0.02:

Save up for some better small-diaphragm condensors, like the SM81 mic's.  Or as another option, I understand that some of the Audio-Technica condensors are actually pretty good (sorry, I don't recall the numbers offhand - I'll have to do a google/deja search on the rec.audio.pro newsgroup, or ask one of the engineers I know).

I've got a pair of the Marshalls, and they're fine for a "my budget is this much, and not a penny more" situation - but they're not little miracles, by any stretch of the imagination. If you can wait to save up the extra couple of hundred bucks to get better quality, do it.  I plan on upgrading from them at some point, when my budget allows.

(IMHO, YMMV, FWIW, and all other hideous Internet disclaimers apply...)

Bart Elliott

Thanks for the input.

I'm always of the belief that I buy the best of everything. If I don't have the money, I wait until I have the money to get the best. The best is subjective ... but basically means, to me, the best money can buy for what I really need ... which is something that will deliver what I need ... and that I'll be VERY happy with.